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On the Ball
Abbreviated Trey: Doomed In Three Minutes
Photo copyright 2008 NBAE (Photo by Melissa Majchrzak/NBAE via Getty Images)
Game #40, Road Game #21: Utah 112, Minnesota 107
Season Record: 13-27
1. No-Quit Grit Not Quite Enough
A game like this loss to Utah will do more to enhance the Wolves' reputation around the league than yesterday's tepid win against a decimated Clippers club. Minnesota was not ready to play a team that competes hard at both ends of the floor, a team that traditionally leads the NBA in fouls and sets more back-screens and doubles down harder than perhaps any club in the league. Deron Williams bushwacked Bassy Telfair with a full flush of assists--5 of them in less than 6 minutes--while the Jazz chose to gang-guard Al Jefferson and let Telfair shoot to his heart's content. The result was a 12-0 deficit for Minnesota, three misses for Telfair and zero attempts for Big Al after 2 minutes and 43 seconds of the game had passed. By that point you already knew that Paul Milsapp had a motor the Wolves weren't going to match--he had a steal, four rebounds and a three-point play in the first 2:08--and that Mehmet Okur was waaay too much for Craig Smith to handle. Color commentator Jim Petersen adroitly lamented the Smith-Okur mismatch early and often; and Jim Souhan wondered numerous times in the postgame why Kevin Love didn't get more minutes. This isn't hindsight: Even on games where Smith plays well, like the win in Phoenix, the best that can be hoped is that both he and the man he is guarding spin the abacus and raise the score, because the Rhino isn't stopping anybody who is larger than 6-9 and has half a clue. And he sure isn't stopping Mehmet Okur.
But the Wolves battled back, to the point of putting their fans into the woulda-coulda-shoulda mode by climbing back to just a point down with 4:28 to play on the strength of a Randy Foye steal-and-layup and his by-now standard crunchtime trey. But both Mike Miller and Randy Foye (after having his ears burn from all the praise I lavished on him about his reliability at the line when it counts) missed a pair of free throws and the Wolves unwisely pounded the ball into Jefferson in the low block for three straight possessions when down by a digit, perhaps not realizing how exhausted Jefferson was facing the triple teams and chasing the quick but strong Milsapp around the court. Petersen had an especially good night, nailing Jefferson's failure to find Milsapp and his overplaying on help defense, and pointing out that the Wolves were overdoing the feed Jefferson angle during that frustrating trio of misses. He bitched about the refs plenty (and by "he" I could be talking about Jefferson but am referring to Petersen), but mostly was more analyst than cheerleader.
Utah obviously didn't expect this level of tenacity from Minnesota. Four or five times, they spread the lead out to double digits or high single-digits, only to have the Wolves stage a return flurry. When it was over, the Wolves had shot 51.2% from the field, registering more field goals and three pointers than Utah, but losing it at the line, where the Jazz were 27-29 to Minnesota's 11-16. I thought the foul disparity came down the truism that the refs reward the more consistently aggressive team. When Minnesota upped its intensity level more in the second half, the calls evened out. You can't say the Wolves "came to play" because they obviously didn't--they needed to work their way into the game and realize that unless they buckled down they would be blown out. Not a "moral victory," but perhaps a bit of nobility in the honor of extending the uncertainty of the outcome through about 45 minutes.
2. Bassy Shoots, Miller Dishes
Sebastian Telfair's ball-handling and distribution skills are of NBA-starter caliber, so his second straight game of nine assists and one turnover don't surprise and thus don't thrill me much. But after trying too hard to burn Utah for leaving him unguarded, Telfair settled in and hit 7 of his last 11 shots. Conditioned to Bassy the Bricklayer, I involuntarily cringe nearly every time he goes up. Telfair's willingness to accept the scoring challenge offered up by Jerry Sloan and company is consistent with his recently escalating antipathy with the refs: It demonstrates that his confidence has swollen to the point where he no longer thinks of himself as a role player, least among the starters. The seven field goals were a season high, the 14 attempts tied a season high, and the nine dimes tied for second best in his season, I'm still not sure a gunnin' Bassy is the best idea on a squad that boasts Jefferson and Foye, but point guards have to adopt and maintain a squirrelly attitude, an arrogant generosity, which is about where Telfair was at in Salt Lake City. Almost every one of those shots made good sense. Now if we can only get Mike Miller to attempt some like it.
After royally ripping Miller in my last trey, I sheepishly watched him laying baskets on a platter with regularity in the first half, particularly his catering to Jefferson's needs for easy touches in the low block. He played hard and he played relatively well, with 8 rebounds and six assists. But his two short-armed free throws, both of which grazed the front iron, helps solve the mystery of his reluctant shot-taking--he feels bereft of prowess taking shots, a skill that is his signature virtue in the NBA. But a few 3-17 FGs would be worth it if Miller could find his stroke, as this watered-down Jason Kidd imitation has more integrityh than value. He hit a trey for his first shot and actually made a "whaddaya know" face, which means he's thinking about it too much. His second trey was way off, then came the short free throws. His final shot attempt was a slam dunk late in cruchtime, when the team needed a trey. Three shots in 27:50, versus Jefferson's 21 FGA, Foye's 16, Bassy's 14.... only Rodney Carney, who played less than half as many minutes, had fewer attempts among the 9 Wolves logging minutes.
3. Quick Hits
For better and worse, Ryan Gomes remains a barometer. Like his teammates, Gomes wasn't ready for the quickness and fervor of his matchup, CJ Miles, who schooled and beat him up a little during the first half of the first period. But it was the rugged defense and timely shooting of Gomes who brought Minnesota back to contention in the 3rd and 4th quarters. He mugged Deron Williams without engendering a whistle to force one transition basket, and executed another steal a few minutes later. He got earnest about his footwork, scrambled back in transition and finished with 19 points (8-16 FG, 3-6 3ptFG), 5 rebounds and three steals, but, as evidence of his checkered performance, also lodged a game-worst minus -14 in his 35:25.
As if the course of this game wasn't already bucking a half-dozen patterns, Kevin Love started finishing around the rim. There was a little more speed getting the shot up after a feed and after an offensive rebound. Slowly but surely, the rook is advancing.
The reputation of Randy Wittman probably couldn't get any lower than it is now, in the wake of this McHale coached resurgence. But whether you liked him or not, Wittman emphasized defense far more than McHale, and that inverted priority revealed itself in the Wolves' inept reactions the classic Sloan menu of quadruple screens and back-door cuts and taut pick and rolls and interior passes. There were a half-dozen defensive embarassments; plays where a member of the Jazz caught the ball two feet from the hoop without a Minnesota player within ten feet of him. Both the execution and the communication were shoddy. Jefferson was the most obvious culprit, but it was a team-wide breakdown and it started at the top, from the coach on the sidelines.
I've been meaning to comment on this for a few games now: Has anyone else seen a player be able to drive forward and full speed and then, while leaping, contort the top half of their body backwards, even as their entire body is moving forwards, with the backards bend creating just enough room to get off the shot? This is a Randy Foye specialty.this fadeaway penetration. Maybe it comes from having your heart on the right side of your body.
35 Reader Comments
The Wolves lost because of free throw disparity, fouling, and atrocious interior defense. The fouling and free throws were problems that plauged the Wolves last season, as well as the beginning of this season. The Jazz only committed 15 fouls to our 25, and went 27 of 29(!!!) from the free throw line. That's an absurd 93%. The Wolves, on the other hand, were only 11 of 16 from the line, for 69%. Pwned.
For any casual fans that may or may not have watched the game: In case you didn't know, Big Al's defense and court awareness is atrocious. It looks like he's wading through concrete, for as fast as he tries to defend against any cutters coming into the lane, or for as well as he can play help defense. Which, as I am getting at, he can't. I don't know about any of you, but I thought Al meant it this off-season when he said he was going to "really work on his defense" and "lead his teammates by playing better defensively" and blah blah blah. Well, hmmm. At this point I hope no one plays defense like him, because he's been one of our worst defenders this season. Yeah, he can score. No one is disputing that. But is defense is so far from franchise cornerstone it's not even funny. He'd be considered a bad defender even if he was playing at the Y.
The Wolves and Jazz are clearly the two whitest teams in the NBA. At one point there were 7 white guys on the court. You just don't see that anymore. Those few minutes were a throwback to a scarier, (much) less athletic era. Some of those guys out there were so white I had thought I spilt milk over my glasses.
Britt,
You are being way too kind to Miller and Jefferson regarding their defense. It frankly sucked.
Miller simply lacks the quickness to cover on the perimeter. I sincerely believe that some of that is a residual effect of the ankle injury. But it still does not matter - if he is out there - he needs to do the job. His man back door him several times in the 2nd quarter for easy dunks, he was late for the double team and his rotation looked like he was in slow motion. I have not seen the ± this morning, but it could not have been good.
He short armed the open 3 against the Heat in crunch time. Now, he short arms free throws in crunch time. At what point does McHale simply give him a few games off to start over? Because right now, he has pretty much killed his trade value and is not helping the team all that much either.
Jefferson played the most uninspired defense I have seen all year. One 4 minute sequence in particular galled me. Around the 6 minute mark in the 4th, Love has Okur and Jefferson has Milsap. Milsap abuses Jefferson with 2 lay ups and 4 rebounds mainly because Al is UNWILLING to block him out. To simply put a body on him. So, we switch and Love takes Milsap and Jefferson takes Okur. Twice in a row, Jefferson fails to hustle out to guard Okur on the perimeter allowing Okur to hit 2 uncontested 3's - pretty much sealing the game.
In the midst of this, Jefferson tries to compensate for his lack of defense by monopolizing the ball offensive. He missed 3 shots in a row (the last a 20 fter) - all contested - never once looking for a teammate.
Al is being paid like a superstar. McHale needs to start demanding that he play like one on BOTH ends of the floor. This was a very winnable game if Al show 25% of his offensive intensity on the defensive end.
I had earlier suggested that maybe part of the issue was conserving energy for the offensive end. I am starting to buy in to the somewhat popular opinion that Al just does not care about defense. That is a huge problem going forward.
I'm thinking and hoping that it will be easier to get this team to play defense one they realize that defense will get them more wins and that winning is fun.
So, to be a complete McHale apologist, I hope his plan is to get them to win some games and enjoy themselves. They then realize that if they like winning and want to win more games they will have to improve their defense.
I know that Big Al should realize this now, but what' his incentive (to go hard and intelligently on defense) when he believes that it is his offense that will produce wins and burnish his reputation around the league?
If only Foye could do the backward bend thing, hit the shot, and make a trip to the foul line. But, I think he's probably too short and not enough of a leaper to force the action. If he doesn't do the back bend he gets blocked and not fouled.
To add another item to the hindsight is 20/20 department, Paul Milsap was available in the second round when the Wolves drafted Craig Smith. Ouch.
It is a game like this that causes me to believe that Al Jefferson is not the player we want to build around.
Al his major issues came up in this game and pushed us over the edge to lose.
As commented, his extremely poor defense and lack of effort on that end of the floor.
What was not mentioned was his refusal to pass the ball to WIDE OPEN team mates when he has the ball in the post. He needs to start making teams pay for double and triple teaming him.
How many games do we need to see these issues to realize that this is who he is as a player? And question if he should remain on the team in the long run.
Rob
I understand the Jefferson angst today--his defense was atrocious. But he wasn't alone in that regard. Just A Fan appropriately cites Miller, but Gomes and Foye likewise had problems, Carney was overmatched physically on Harpring, and the entire Wolves team just didn't work as hard against a very physical Jazz outfit that rubs off defenders and is constantly on the move both on the baseline and angling in from the wings. They are large and rugged and rangey, and only Love and (in the second half) Gomes seemed to be able to match their physical style.
At the other end of the court, I simply wish all the Jefferson naysayers who talk about his lack of ball movement would notice his shooting percentage and points in crunchtime. Yes, he was unsuccessful in Utah. I hope you were patting him on the back as he helped carry the team in Phoenix and LA.
* I saw the game streamed on a PC, so did my eyes deceive me when I saw Randy Foye make an ally-oop dunk? He got some nice lift! I also thought I saw him go left AND finish with his left hand. If my eyes didn't deceive me, those are two rare and welcomed sights from His Clutchness.
* Sigh....Al Jefferson. I think we're getting to a "can't live with him, can't live without him" phase. He puts so much pressure on the defense and gives an offense great solace to know that you can always throw it down to him when other options aren't available or aren't working. On the other hand, his liabilities nearly cancel out his assets. All you have to do is look at +/- stats from last season and this season to realize that he isn't the type of difference maker you build around. The fact remains we don't have a "build around" player. We have "build with" players and we need more of them.
* Noah and Varejao are two examples of mobile big men that can get out and hassle bigs like Okur on the perimeter, whilst having the length to also contribute on interior defense. I mention these two since their names come up from time-to-time in trade/free agent discussions.
Fans who don't want Al Jefferson on the team, in the long run, should elaborate and paint a picture of how you see this franchise improving without him.
The most obvious question is, who comes back in the trade? Second, is what makes up the rest of the roster and lineup. And last, who is your go-to guy?
I love that the Wolves are at a point where a gritty-come-from-behind narrow loss on the road to a tough team on a back-to-backi is viewed as a disappointment by regulars here. Compared to the last 100 games the Wolves have played this is true progress.
Hallelujah to dumping on Big Al. Here here to ripping on Mike Miller's shortcomings. All hail questioning Coach McHale's overplaying the undersized Craig Smith. Yippee that Rod Carney has moved so far beyond Gerald-Green-sideshow that his play is open to legitimate criticism.
Keep it up Wolves and keep it up Britt's Army!
I think the problem with Big Al in the game last night was more of an in-game quality control issue with the head coach more than anything else. I'm not saying he should go to the Witt school of jerking guys around, but there have to be in-game standards above and beyond "game time is the players' time and practice is the coaches' time". When your star player is sleep walking up the court while delayed 3/4 court passes sail over his head with ease and he's literally the last person in the building to notice, there has to be some sort of way for the coaching staff to address this in real time and with a bit more oomph than letting Al stay on the court after some of those massive breakdowns. I get the confidence thing that McHale has brought to this squad with his loosey-goosey approach but he has to draw the line somewhere and that damn 3/4 court pass over a guy who wasn't paying attention should have crossed the line. As should have several of his missed defensive and rebounding assignments. It doesn't even have to be negative. It could be as simple as "Look Al, tonight just isn't your night. They're collapsing on you and we need to have greater spacing and for you to pay more attention to Milsap and Okur. Take 5 on the bench to gather your thoughts about the new approach to the game and we'll hold down the fort while you're out."
Andy G.
I am not sure anyone wants to see Big Al off the roster.
What needs to be determined is whether or not Big Al is that key "super star" talent that every championship team needs.
Defense is the key to championships. It took Kobe about 6 years to get it. LeBron figured it out this summer on the Olympic team. So, I am willing to give Big Al sometime.
But, as I say, if he does not, it is a huge problem going forward.
Britt,
I'll bite. How many times was Big Al triple teamed in Phoenix? How many times in LA? I can't recall any in Phoenix and no more than a couple in LA. If Big Al is going to be played 1 on 1 with basic help defense, sign me up to feed him the ball until he barfs.
But last night, Al was triple teamed nearly every time he touched the ball in the 4th quarter. After unsuccessfully trying to bull his way through everyone, he allowed himself to be pushed outside and settled for a 20' jump shot. Sorry, but he needs to recognize that if 3 guys are on him, someone is open. Move the ball. And I lay part of this on McHale who needs to be much firmer with Big Al in those situations.
He's 24. I'm sure he'll get better defensively or passing out of double teams quicker with better recognition on where the ball needs to go. I can't name a guy at the age of 24 who had the whole package. I know we're talking competence here (or that is what you guys are asking of Big Al), but maybe Big Al is unique, because usually it is the offensive game that the big man has to work on as the career progresses. Not the other way around.
Was Hakeem better than Big Al at age 24? Seriously, because I never actually watched him play until his championship days. Please no larger than life Paul Bunyon - Mythical comparisons - "like back in Hakeem's day they would send the whole team on him and he would fake each defender out, one by one to the rim!"
More interetingly, was Big Al better than Mchale when Mac was 24?
http://www.basketball-reference.com/fc/pcm_finder.cgi?request=1&sum=1&p1...
If you guys don't use it already, check out Basketball Reference's Full Court player comparison tool. It's good stuff. I put the link up for McHale and Jefferson at age 24. Granted, McHale went to college so it's a bit tough to compare straight up (and the league was much, much different way back when)but it's an interesting topic.
It will be interesting to see if Jefferson can develop into the McHale of 86-when his body started to fall apart. He was putting up ORtgs above 120 which is Michael Jordan/LBJ territory. His career high was 126 points produced/100 possessions while Al is at 109 right now. McHale was an amazing, amazing player from 86 to 90. McHale was also a fairly effective defensive player who didn't turn the ball over a lot.
My only real beef with Big Al is the lack of effort defensively. The only excuse for him playing as poorly on that end of the floor as he normally does is that he's not trying hard enough. He may not have the tools of a Duncan or KG, but he has enough in his toolbox (wide body, decent quickness, 7'3 wingspan) that, if supplemented with a healthy dose of effort, that he could at least be solid. If he put in half the effort and played with half the smarts Love does on that end of the floor, I'd say he's at least a league average defender.
I'm not sure if this Al's fault or if it is a coaching issue, but I suspect a bit of both. I don't know what they practice (well, not ALL of it), but i wonder if Al is given some preferential treatment due to his status as "the man" on the team. I wonder if the coaching staff needs to spend some one-on-one time with him to drill team D fundamentals into his head. Some accountability on that end, like SnP suggested, would also certainly help.
As to his offense last night, I also wonder if there was a bit of a jealous "I need to get mine" mentality going on. With the emergence of Foye and all the (deserved) "4th Quarter Foye" talk, I wonder if Al decided he had to make his mark after Foye's awesomely standard steal/layup and timely 3 to remind us he's still the man. Other than that, I can't for the life of me think up a reason for him to be jacking up those terrible, contested shots in crunch time when Foye was CLEARLY gearing up for some more crazy crunch-time antics. It seems to me that, now that he has some talent around him, Al needs to work on learning to play as part of a team instead of being the man all the time.
SnP-
I wouldn't mind seeing McHale get after Al for laziness if it's apparent, but he can't take it too far. He did that against Miami (more reward to Cardinal than punishment to Al, but still) and it cost us the game.
JAF-
I do not think that Jefferson will ever be a superstar on a championship team. If the Wolves ever win a title with Al, they'll have a great guard and a slew of good supporting players (we actually might have those, already).
Looking at the top of each conference, the best teams have players way out of Jefferson's league. Literally, the best of the West have Kobe and Duncan and the best of the East have KG, Howard and LeBron. Those guys are on another level. I doubt there's a Wolves fan around who disagrees with that.
I just don't see why that should open Jefferson up to constant criticism. It seems like many of the commenters here, and at Canis, are VERY quick to break down every little detail that Jefferson screwed up, while they do the exact opposite for Love and Telfair. A person who had never watched the Wolves, but only read those comments would think Jefferson was our team's problem--when in fact--he's its bright spot.
Moving forward, he'll need to learn how to mix with The Good Randy Foye and whatever talent we bring in. It doesn't change the fact that our team has hopped on his back for 90+% of the last 1.5 seasons and he's saved us from much embarrassment on many nights, with very consistent scoring and rebounding.
* Regardless if we have Al or not, we still need length and athleticism in the frontcourt and more firepower in the backcourt. That simplifies our continued rebuilding process since there isn't a completely different player personnel route we'd have to take if Al was moved at some point.
* If, and that's a BIG if, we can add further length and talent upfront, Al becomes more tradeable because Love will eventually be the superior PF. I'm not saying Love is a "build around" guy either, but I do think he'll eventually be a better all-around player that makes the whole better than the sum-of-the-parts. Al has all the makings of a sum-of-the-parts guy.
* SNP, thanks for calling up the McHale comparison. People tend to forget how truly great McHale was in the low blocks. And mind you, these weren't dunks and putbacks, but mostly turnarounds, up-and-unders, jump hooks, and mid-range jumpers that he was converting at a ridiculously high rate. Parish benefited from Bird's playmaking more than McHale because he had great hands to catch his passes. McHale did most of his damage on his own.
Great stuff from both sides of this issue--I essentially agree with everybody.
With a few notable exceptions, I don't think there is much of a gap between the Jefferson critics and the Jefferson defenders here. For my part, I just wanted it pointed out that Foye, Gomes and Miller were also undressed in ways that were nearly as ridiculous as the 3/4 court pass S+P references, and Telfair clearly was the primary reason the Wolves were blitzed in the first three minutes (well, McHale too). Williams had 5 assists right away, Bassy was befuddled by being given blatantly open looks, and Utah was moving away from their defenders all over the court. How that translates into Jefferson being the primary focus of criticism strikes me as too selective.
Randy Foye also took some plays off last night. Craig Smith was getting whupped so often that Jefferson began overhelping on defense, a fact that resulted in huge miscommunication when Love, who didn't need as much help, shared the floor with him. This overhelping sort of rebuts the "Jefferson doesn't care" argument.
All that said, the folks who are on Jefferson have ammunition. JAF provided a great rebuttal to my point, although I would argue again that Jefferson was mentally and physically exhausted and probably got tunnel vision in the low block (and yeah, that's an excuse/rationale; I just happen to think it is true). Jefferson was flat-out worked over by Milsapp, who hustled harder at both ends of the court. And Mehmet Okur has actually developed into a decent defender. I loved that Sloan went against the NBA grain and didn't mind switching in transition, having Okur guard Jefferson even though Okur was being guarded by Smith (yet another McHale mistake).
I think I've been pretty consistent praising Jefferson's offense and ripping his defense. For what it's worth, Jefferson was a second-worst minus -9 in 35:16 last night, which means the Wolves were plus +4 in the 12:44 he sat.
One last thought: When does the Craig Smith as starter phase finally end? On Friday, the Wolves face the Hornets, meaning Jefferson is on Chandler--a great matchup--and Smith contends with David West, with Gomes on Peja. Given CP3's dribble penetration skills, I think Smith is a huge liability versus West, and unless he can somehow work his Rhino-dribble-drives through West and Chandler, it is going to be a long night. I'd much rather see Love matched up on West.
Al deserves the criticism. I once called him a "Low post McCants." This was more than a reference to how he plays, it was a reference to a basketball death curse that he share with McCants: Each thinks he is better than he is. With Jefferson this can almost be forgiven, because he's damn good. But anyone who has ever played the game knows that there is something deeper than +/- stats and the ability to score. It is the ability to have the players around you feel that you are going to utilize them as part of the game and not simply rely on yourself to do everything, even if it turns out you are successful. Playing with someone who thinks its his game is a very wearing experience. And too many NBA players have an "I'm the man" attitude that mucks up a team. Witness Marbury's pout in the face of KG's dominance, or the friction between TMac and Vince. Teams work when the star knows that he shines brightest when his teammates are the beneficiaries of his talent, and not just the observers of it. If Big Al doesn't learn this and McHale can't coach it into him, he is not the building block we want him to be. Even Kobe had to figure this out, and Big Al is no Kobe.
Here's my problem with Big Al, and the reason that I'm a sometime hater: he doesn't try on defense. The game he played against Yao is the exception that proves the rule. He can do it. How often does he give that sort of effort on defense? I don't know if I've ever seen it. He needs to try. That's all.
I think he's afraid of getting posterized, and therefore decides to barely cover his man so if he gets dunked on, at least he's not getting a pair in the face. How many times has his man scored while he's on the other side of the court complaining? I've seen that more often than I've seen consistent effort on D from him. I love his moves, I love his rebounding, but I hate a player that doesn't try.
Was Hakeem better than Big Al at age 24? Seriously, because I never actually watched him play until his championship days. Please no larger than life Paul Bunyon - Mythical comparisons - "like back in Hakeem's day they would send the whole team on him and he would fake each defender out, one by one to the rim!"
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I am a Big Al fan, but this is a ridiculously one sided comparison. Olajuwon was much better than Jefferson. Olajuwon was a tremendous athlete who, despite starting basketball late, had great footwork due to his soccer background.
The best visual evidence would be watching the 1986 NBA Finals. The 23 year old Olajuwon went up against one of the great teams in NBA history with an all Hall of Fame front court and was nearly unstoppable.
Seriously. Catch the games on classic or grab the DVDs and watch. He was amazing.
I think what gets lost in the Big Al vs Hakeem (or McHale) comparisons, or big Al as defensive slacker vs superstar thoughts is that the last month has been fun. I'm attending Friday night's game with excitement and a big part of that is watching Jefferson on offense. Our team is a top five player away from contending, so let's enjoy the ride and give appropriate, but measured analysis. Big Al isn't the problem any more than 4th quarter Foye is the solution. We have a sub-middle-of-the-road team that will win with offense or win nothing at all. Championships are won with defense, but even a 30-35 win team can entertain with offense.
(For defense wins championships, please check the Barn)
Great discussion. If Hakeem was even better than he was when he was going toe to toe against young Shaq, then he must have been a force against the Celts in 1986.
I remembered that series, but admittedly - too young for my analyzing skills to be at their best. I remember the Lakers couldn't match Hakeem and Ralph Sampson Sr. in the series before, but the Celtics had enough height to match the Twin Towers. Thanks to the networks (and the fact that my pops said 'no' to cable TV) playing only the Celtics, Lakers, Pistons, and Bulls - I never got to see Olajuwon until he got older.
I do believe that Mac and Olajuwon were better at 24 than Big Al is at 24, but having a good, legit big man with size next to you to help cover things up, might help out too. I'm sure the tandem of David West and Tyson Chandler will provide a challenge to Big Al.
Just a few things to follow up:
First, I don't think Big Al is a slacker or that he is the sole problem on this team. The problem with Al is a fan one: believing he can be something that he's not. Love and Telfair don't get as much attention and criticism because they're not the centerpiece of the trade that sent away a future hall of famer and which around the new team is being completely rebuilt.
Second, there were plenty of defensive mishaps last night by numerous players. Gomes, Smith, and Jefferson (and sometimes Foye) being the primary offenders. I just used Big Al as an example of the lack of in game quality control that this coaching staff has. When their best player gets away with the on-court equivalent of murder, something is wrong.
Third, I'd say that Jefferson's mistakes are more noteworthy and talkable because he factors into over 20% of his team's total possession. He is the best of the good and the worst of the bad all in one. How can you not talk about his shortcomings when they are every bit as notable as his peaks? I think he gets the attention here and at Hoopus because he's been IT on this team for so long. He's a tremendously gifted, yet flawed, player.
Overall, I think the standard I would like to see applied to Big Al is that he is pushed to aspire more to 18/14 with situational defense than 25/10 and matador action. Less cornerstone, more supporting wall.
Andy,
I don't see the Twolves competing for a championship for several years. So, the Big Al, vs KG, Duncan, and even Kobe comparison are not where I am headed. Those guys (and their teams) will like be on the tail end of their careers by the time the Twolves are ready to compete.
LeBron is a once in a lifetime talent and it is/will be unfair to compare anyone with him. But will Big Al be in the same conversation as Wade (who will be by far the oldest of the group) Oden/Roy, Durant/Westbrooke, Dwight Howard, Rose, Lopez, Bosh (I am sure I am missing a few)? Those are his super stars in waiting competition for a championship.
With the exception of Wade, all these other guys, just like Al, have some serious weaknesses in their game that need to be corrected before they reach super star status. We have, rightly so, rewarded Al with the big contract based on his performance and potential. That means he HAS to be a super star (or damn close) for the Twolves to win. Too much money tied up if he is not. Which is why I think it will be a problem if he doesn't become a better defender.
RE: Al vs. Mchale. That is probably a best-case scenario for Al on offense, and one of the better comps for his offensive style. Two things, though:
1) Mchale was also the best defensive player on the Celtics (competition with Dennis Johnson). Mchale was often given the assignment of guarding the best wing or big man on the opposing team, letting Bird guard the weaker. He had the versatility to even guard some shooting guards without being embarrassed, and the length to go at any center of that time. Before Jefferson can completely be on the Mchale continuum, he has to drastically step up his defense.
2) Even as great as Mchale was, he was still secondary to Bird. This is a key point that has been mentioned already in this thread, but that I agree with: Big Al isn't the best player on a contending team. Even as young as he is, I don't even think he has that upside. Therefore, this makes opportunities to bring in new players (like this upcoming draft) vital, as the Wolves need to come up with their franchise guy.
Big Al, Foye, and Love all could have definite roles on a contender. Possibly Gomes or even Brewer as well. Now, we need the centerpiece that anchors them all together and lets them compete against the best of the best. As Midlife points out, a Jefferson-led team can be entertaining, fun, and competitive. But to be a contender, we need something more.
Here's a trade for the Wolves. Personally, I'm really getting soured on Al this year. Between his yelling at teammates, non-leadership, non-existent Defense, and overall blackholedness (I just made that up), I wouldn't mind trading him if the right trade came along.
What do you guys think about this?
Jefferson to Portland for Aldridge and Bayless (+ whatever junk contracts we have to take back to make salaries work, but we would get the "best" ones they have.)
It helps both teams. We've been discussing this over on the TWolvesblog forums, and one of our members made this blog post about this trade over on a Blazers blog if anyone wants to check out their crazy comments (lol!):
http://www.blazersedge.com/2009/1/21/730227/lamarcus-aldridge-jerryd-b
Anyways, they get interior scoring and one of the best young post up men in the league (plus they still have Oden and the Vanilla Gorilla for defense), and the Wolves get a versatile player much akin to a young Rasheed Wallace (skill-wise, not attitude.) Also, I believe Bayless has some tremendous potential and could be a great asset. Unfortunately, I highly doubt Portland would do the trade :-(
I got a pretty good dose of Olajuwon's play by dint of living in Houston during his Phi Slamma Jamma days and then for a couple of his years with the Rockets. I'll flatly say that Jefferson is not at Hakeem's level -- especially on defense.
Hakeem had a nearly unmatched combination of size, strength, and agility. He might have been even more amazing had he grown up playing basketball "in the `hood" instead of keeping goal in Nigeria. From time to time, you could see little naiveties in his game. But I always thought that Olajuwon tried to play the game "the right way".
And hey, as a 24 year old, Hakeem was carrying stiffs like Jim Peterson to the playoffs.
JAF-
Good points. But there is always a wave of superstars at any snapshot in time. At no point, will there be a time when Al Jefferson is in the top eschelon, like Kobe and KG are, right now. When Al is 27 or 28, I think the group will look something like:
LeBron
Howard
Oden
Rose
Paul
Williams
DeAndre Jordan
OK, the last one was a joke, from the last thread. But again, I don't think anybody has ever considered Al to have top-flight superstar potential.
I do think that Al can become (if he's not already) better than most big men, even guys like Pau Gasol and Amare Stoudamire. I think his low-post game is more unstoppable than theirs and defensively he either has less to work on (than Amare) or more time to work on it (than Gasol). So, in the right system, he could certainly be viewed as an important piece of a championship-contender. He just needs more of that caliber-talent around him.
Portland would never trade Aldridge, let alone Aldridge AND Bayless, for Al, no matter how good he is down low.
I've got a question for everybody here:
Under Kevin McHale's regime on the bench, Randy Foye appears to be playing like an elite NBA guard.
When is the last time a Timberwolves coach significantly developed the talents and value of a Timberwolves player?
Big Al,
hmmm. "The Timberwolves will never win a championship with BIg Al as the ceneterpiece." hmmm. It just sounds so familiar... Let's see, I think it went like this, "The Timberwolves will never win a championship with KG as the go to man in the fourth qtr." Wait, I said that.
It takes five players even with Jordan and Lebron. With Jefferson it will take more help than KG, Jordan or Lebron. His contract is reasonable. Randy Foye is emerging as a possibility for being one of those pieces for help.
But, right now, the Wolves are winning. I wanted Wittman to succeed, but after this run of success by McHale it looks like Wittman's 38-105 Twolve coaching record is going to bookended on either side by Casey and McHale with .500 or better records. I'm sorry, but I don't need to see any evidence of Wittman's coaching on this team even if it means we give up a little team defense. McHale has these guys playing like most of us thought the team was capable of performing at. Better team defense (and individual) might be nice, but right now I'll take what we got.
As far as a trade with Portland, Portland may not do it, but the TWolves shouldn't do it either. I happen to be looking forward to Feb 27 as a good barameter for where this team is at and where it will be going. If we can stay around .500 till then and then beat Portland and have Foye outplay Roy, I am going to go running through the streets naked screaming like a lunatic (you all will read about it in the newspaper the next morning, if there is a newspaper). THis is what I watch b-ball for. This is why I have remained a twolf fan through the whole Casey and Wittman era. I know, I'll start complaining and expecting more from these guys soon, but right now I'm just basking in the moment and getting excited about the continued improvement over the rest of the season.
I'll bite. I'd argue that Wally Szczerbiak owes his fat contract to the crisp perimeter passing and midrange shooting-oriented offense implemented by Flip Saunders. Injuries had something to do with Wally's decline post-Wolves, but I think Flip was the ideal coach to bring out his one specific talent. I'd also argue that Flip got the most out of Stephon Marbury--and so would Marbury. And most recently, Sam Cassell has had some fabulous seasons, but none better than he fared under Flip's system in 04-05. Cassell and Szczerbiak are in their 16th and 10th NBA seasons, respectively, and both earned their only All Star appearance while being coached by Flip (and teammates with KG, but if you get into that conversation it is a whole other topic).
Going further back, Bill Musselman took a bunch of castoffs and won 51 games during the franchise's first two seasons. If you don't think Muss squeezed the absolute most out of the likes of Scott Roth, Tod Murphy, and Randy Breuer, you weren't there.
Thanks, Britt. I wasn't there. So three guys since Musselman. And to be honest, each is a bit of a stretch. Wally and Stephon were well-utilized, which is different, I think, from truly developed or transformed in any meaningful way. So too Sam as I think about it. He was a good cog put in a position to do the most good.
If that's the best we can do here, that tells me the Wolves body of work as developers of players has been piss-poor. That's not to say we haven't had good coaches here (or at least a good coach or two), but if 200 guys (my estimate) have worn a Wolves uni and we are scratching for a handful, that seems awfully weak.
Thanks, Britt. I wasn't there. So three guys since Musselman. And to be honest, each is a bit of a stretch. Wally and Stephon were well-utilized, which is different, I think, from truly developed or transformed in any meaningful way. So too Sam as I think about it. He was a good cog put in a position to do the most good.
If that's the best we can do here, that tells me the Wolves body of work as developers of players has been piss-poor. That's not to say we haven't had good coaches here (or at least a good coach or two), but if 200 guys (my estimate) have worn a Wolves uni and we are scratching for a handful, that seems awfully weak.
It didn't help that they lost - I believe- 4 #1 picks from the Joe Smith deal. And reached in the draft on questionable talents Avery, Grant, and Ebi.
Some guys who had a minor resurgence when they played here were Laphonso Ellis and Malik Sealy. Googs was probably better with us than he was anywhere else, including Washington. Peeler's first year with us was good, but uneven after that. Sam Mitchell was a CBA vet who wound up having a solid NBA career.
I'd agree with Britt on this one and add a few more. Wally did require some development; he was a better player when he left than even when he became a full-time starter. Before the trade, he was averaging about 20 per game with Casey. I'd also say that Chauncey Billups learned a lot about being a dependable ballhandler and playmaker from Flip (and Terrell Brandon). Rasho was a better player when he left than when he came; he ended up being limited, but he was playing really well in his last season. Even KG was developed to a certain extent. A guy like Craig Smith is a better player now than he was as a rookie; he's improved his game while maximizing his physical abilities.
I'd say, though, that good coaches do both: maximize talent and develop it. Even a guy like Dwight Howard is an example of this; would he be as good without the great shooters around him? He'd still be really good, but his talent has been maximized because the system emphasizes his strengths.
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