Dude Weather Subscribe to Secrets Minneapolis / St. Paul

On the Ball

The Three Pointer: Painless #60

Share

AP Photo by Carlos Osorio

Game #81, Road Game #41: Minnesota 103, Detroit 115

Season Record: 21-60

1. One More Smallball Razzing

Since this will probably be my last Wolves three-pointer of the year (I'll either do a season evaluation and/or cover the team's press conference later this week after tomorrow's Milwaukee tilt), it's appropriate that I jackhammer on the anti-smallball theme one more time, eh?

Without being a conspiracy theorist, isn't it odd that we finally got a long look at Jefferson-Gomes-Brewer-McCants-Foye the other night (a lineup one might think would be deployed on a more regular basis, given that it best reflects the five players this organization is probably most invested in right now) and tonight had not one but two stints where Al Jefferson and Chris Richard actually were allowed to play on the floor together? Now, granted, the first one was just 3:16 in the second period and the second only a tad longer at 3:33 in the fourth, which is hardly a large sample. But lo and behold, how did the Wolves and Jefferson fare in that combined 6:49?

How about plus +9, factored out at plus +1 in the first half stint and plus +8 in the second half one. If you go plus +9 in 6:49 of a 12-point loss, that means the Wolves were a miserable minus -21 in the 41:11 Jefferson and Richard didn't play together. Here's another interesting stat: On a night when Jefferson labored hard to get his 30 points, shooting 12-26 FG, he was 4-5 FG during his time with Richard, and thus 8-21 FG without Richard. What makes this even more skewed is that Richard had a case of the dropsies tonight; he flubbed an easy slam opportunity on a pick and roll, frittered away a basic feed into the post, and couldn't even retain possession of a rebounded free throw in the final period. Imagine Al Jefferson playing beside a center who could not only hang on to the rock a little bit, but stick a 12-footer just often enough to deter those double-teams. Imagine Ryan Gomes guarding Tayshaun Prince instead of Rasheed Wallace.

2. The Foye-McCants Redundancy

It is quite possible that Randy Foye and Rashad McCants can find a way to co-exist in the same backcourt, especially if they realize it is the only way they both get regular rotation minutes. But in a very fundamental way, they really do have a lot of overlap in their respective games. Neither one of them is really a point guard, in that point guards are working for a seamless blend and a synergistic ensemble above all else--they are the Anthony Hopkins or Gene Hackman of hoops, capable of greatness mostly in the context of their character role. Foye and Shaddy are more like Jack Nicholson, the shooting guard of actors, a guy who is essentially himself regardless of what role he plays, a guy who elevates the ensemble by being a shining star, not a blender.

Everybody knows this about McCants, of course. Tonight he got up 17 shots (making 8, with 2-7 from 3pt range) in 30:30, and received a technical foul for banging into Rodney Stuckey heading back up the court after executing a spectacular dunk that facialed both Jason Maxiell and Amir Johnson in the 4th quarter. Foye is a little less obvious, especially if you just read his stat line in the box score instead of watching him operate an offense. Tonight, for example, he had an impressive 9/1 assist-to-turnover ratio. But what the stats don't show is after he nailed a jumper midway through the first period for his initial points of the night, he waited three seconds on the team's next possession to give himself a heat check and try to stick another. Later that same period, he stepped back and made a trey for his second bucket of the night. Eight seconds into the team's very next offensive possession, he launched another trey--heat check #2 (both heat checks missed).

On a slightly more macro level, Foye very much buys into his 4th quarter mythology. Tonight, he was 4-7 FG with 4 assists after three periods. But in the final 12 minutes, he launched as many shots as he had in the first three quarters (going 2-7 FG) and doled out even more assists (5, versus zero turnovers). In other words, Foye's governance of the offense was much more pronounced in the 4th quarter, in ways that were both good and bad.

There are worse things than two Jack Nicholsons, of course, and by that I mean that both Foye and McCants have undeniable talent. Er, offensive talent, anyway. Neither one seems to be able to play a lick of defense. Randy Wittman has loosened the reins a little bit these past couple weeks, which has certainly made the games more entertaining in the sense of showmanship and skill-rendering, but in the process the Wolves are yielding a whopping 112 points per game during the month of April, and it starts on the perimeter. Tonight, both Chauncey Billups and Ronnie Stuckey could get pretty much anywhere they wanted off the dribble, and Shaddy's defense was equally porous and lackadaisical.

Getting a quality point guard would be a boon for this ballclub in more ways than one. It would shake up the pecking order and compel both Foye and McCants to redefine their styles and priorities. It would also nice to see Jefferson, Foye and McCants all benefit from a slick passer with good court vision who, unlike Mr. Telfair, could keep opponents honest with an accurate jumper and/or an ability to finish at the hole as well.

3. Snyder and Brewer Are Not Redundant

The largest stylstic difference the past few games has been when Brewer and Snyder have subbed in for one another. Even as Snyder's defense has become more sporadic, he has gotten to the rim off the dribble more consistently than any of the swingmen or back court players on the roster. Brewer, on the other hand, is thankfully concentrating on defense and rebounding once more and letting the shots come to him by accident--he was an efficient 4-5 FG in 24:46 tonight as a result.

The biggest similarity between the two small forwards is they both are anxious to exploit opponents in transition and are much less effective when the pace is slow and the offense bogs down in the half court. On the odd chance that Snyder is still around next year, it might be good to see them playing together on a quintet that tries to play three-quarter court traps and just generally pressures the ball. Of course that's best utilized when you have a shot-blocker to help clean up the gambles of pressing, which brings us back to square one (or at least point one) and the need for a pivot man to prevent small ball from becoming the fallback position.

57 Reader Comments

McCleak (not verified)07:37am
Apr 16
Last night I was looking at some of the college players that have declared from the draft. I noticed that Robin Lopez, who is 7-0, and seems to be considered a better defender and at least as athletic as his brother, is expect to go in the late first, early second round. My question to those who watch college hoops is twofold. First: is this accurate? Second, should the Wolves go after him?
Wim (Belgium) (not verified)08:50am
Apr 16
The few games I saw, it's accurate. The overall talent is lower than his brother but he is mroe defensive minded. He was projected as a 2nd rounder but he improved his draft stock to late 1st, early 2nd by good tournament play (which I didn't see). So that's accurate as well in my opinion. If he drops down to our 1st pick of the 2nd round, they should defenitly go after him. I wouldn't even feel bad about taking both brothers (granted we drop out of the top 2 that is) for some extra chemistry. If we do trade up to somewhere around 20. I'd rather have Hibbert if he's still there or Thabeet (bigger gamble, bigger upside if you ask me). Devon Hardin is also a guy that flew under the radar by not (?) playing all year because of injury (not sure about that)...
gjk (not verified)11:01am
Apr 16
I'm up for Robin Lopez in the second round or for trading into the teens/20s if Hibbert or Thabeet is still available. Unless they get someone who they know can start at center against every team and hold his own, they're better off getting someone who can be effective for part of the time and platooning him with another guy who can be effective for part of the time in a slightly different way. An example of this would be one of the shotblocking centers in the draft or a free agent like DeSagana Diop or Rasho Nesterovic and a guy like Richard or Madsen or Doleac. They need someone with good defensive skills and awareness; offensively, if they can set screens, rebound, and score inside when open, that's acceptable. Also, I don't think taking Brook Lopez is a good idea under any circumstances. He might be a good player, but he won't be great (or even an all-star), and there are players in the second round who would fit just as well with Jefferson. Any of the other possible lottery picks have at least a chance of becoming an all-star.
Andy G (not verified)11:13am
Apr 16
I agree. My worst nightmare for the draft would be getting the 3rd pick and using it on B Lopez. Either take O.J. Mayo (assuming the Foye-Shaddy death match comes to a head) or trade down and take a tougher center like the others mentioned--possibly even the other Lopez. If interviews/workouts are impressive, I wouldn't even object to trading down for DeAndre Jordan. I used to hate this idea, but if he's really got Dwight Howard-caliber athleticism, with a 7-foot frame, he might look pretty good in a strictly shotblocker/dunker role next to Jefferson. Brook's finesse game does nothing for this team. Jefferson has that covered.
gjk (not verified)11:22am
Apr 16
Agreed on Jordan. If he slips out of the top 10 and the Wolves slip out of the top two, why not? He's definitely athletic and shows some fundamentals. He's also a notch above the other centers in the draft when it comes to athletic ability.
antonymous (not verified)11:46pm
Apr 16
I am so glad Jordan's stock has dropped since the beginning of the season. I am not willing to spend a top pick on a 44 percent FT shooter who doesn't (didn't?) even start on his own team! Not to pick on any one comment, but people always talk about "potential" like it's some kind of abstract concept - if you don't believe me, you can ask Seattle about how their athletic centers have worked out. They'll answer your question right after they select Hasheem Thabeet with the #2 overall pick (we hope)! I'm firmly in the "not Jordan" camp. I think all of us who have followed the Wolves this year are torn between who we want and who we think the organization will use best. I don't think we should worry about taking either Lopez - we seem set using Al at center, which I think many of us take issue with. I think a center and PG are the two top priorities (overall, not just draft-wise) for improving this team, and of course those are the two most difficult positions to learn as a 19-year-old. I'd like to prepare for the worst and hope for the best - obviously there are two players every team would love, but if we don't land one? Anyone think Gordon or Bayless are good options? I'll fully admit to not having watched them this year, and I'm moderately discouraged by Foye-McCants in the backcourt (provided they are without a quality PG to create space for them). My take is that I'd like to see us move our pick down (barring one of the first two picks) - the first round is VERY deep this year, and having a couple of mid-to-late first round picks could net us a couple of solid picks or get leverage with other teams who covet particular guys that low.
Andy G (not verified)08:49am
Apr 17
I'm not a huge fan of Jordan, for the reasons you cited, but if we fall out of the top two, he's one of the only guys on the board that could conceivably grow into a dominant presence in the paint. I'd feel better knowing that we got a 7-footer with bulk and athleticism than I would if we took another small guard or a small forward with all of the question marks and less of the size of Jordan. Saw a fair amount of Gordon. His game is solid, but not spectacular. My guess is that he'll look kind of like Foye, but a couple inches taller, and with a little better floor vision. Not a bad thing to have, but not a need of this team by any stretch and he won't be great enough to justify taking with a position we don't need. O.J. Mayo has a smoother game that reminds me of young Ray Allen--potentially a great thing to have, and I'd support that pick if its 3 or later. Only seen clips of Bayless. Looks to be ridiculously athletic, but only 6'1" and didn't lead his team (with other lotto potential guys on it) to a very good season.
Anonymous (not verified)12:37am
Apr 18
Jefferson is a black hole. He never passes, never attempts defense. Seriously his stats have always been on bad teams.His stats are usually in blowouts from the 1st quarter. Why the love for him? Makes no sense at all.
Anonymous (not verified)01:37am
Apr 18
Being a black hole isn't so bad when you're shooting the percentage he shot this season. He even made a bit of an improvement in passing out of double teams this year. Shoot, I'm pretty sure the coaches were all telling him to make sure he got his shots, so he can't be blamed for any black hole tendencies. Maybe you're confusing Al with Craig Smith. Still, Al is not Garnet. He's not as athletic or talented defensively. He's not even as good of a defensive rebounder as Garnet. He's maybe a slightly better offensive rebounder with a few more post moves. Garnet has a case for being one of the top ten players ever to play in the NBA. Al will never be that good. That being said, at least we have Al who isn't much worse than Bosh, Stoudamire or Dwight Howard. It's not easy to get a player with his touch, size, strength and footwork. And he's still young too. He also doesn't seem to be the jerk Laetner was(and he isn't from Duke). Remember, Al refused to force the wolves to offer a top level contract. He still got plenty, but I think he said something like "I'm not playing at the level deserving of a max contract yet". Laetner never would've said anything like that. I'm pretty sure we're in better shape than we were before drafting Garnet. The West is a lot tougher now than it was then. You had Houston with Hakeem and Drexler, San Antonio with David Robinson, Utah with Malone and Stockton, and Seatlle with Kemp and Payton, but the conference wasn't nine deep like it is this year. I'd rather have Mcants than Isiah Ryhder(sp). I'd rather have Foye than any of the guards we used that season. Still, probably would rather have Gugliotta(sp) than Craig Smith or Gomes. Anyway, I guess I'm pretty young to be comparing these eras. However, I feel like this team is more fun to watch and part of the fun is finding a player like Al to cheer for even if he isn't perfect. Even with the Taylor brigade trying to make the unfortunate case that Al's better than a player who used to wear no 21 and now rocks the no 5 in retro green.
Anonymous (not verified)12:54pm
Apr 16
What might appeal to Wolves management is to trade their top pick down for DeAndre Jordan and a big wad of cash. Jordan's young and needs lots of seasoning, ensuring that we won't be able to figure out what they're building for several additional years.
Anonymous (not verified)11:32am
Apr 16
Rasho has been on fire lately!
stop-n-pop (not verified)11:06am
Apr 16
I'm going to disagree with the center take for a few reasons specific to the current state of the Wolves: 1- Brooke Lopez scares me. A college 7 footer who shoots under 50% with a modest rebound rate is something to be worried about. I'm sure he'll have a nice 6-8 year career in the NBA but drafting a red-flag filled 7 foot role player with the 3rd-7th pick should be a no-go from the get-go. 2- The other centers scare me even more: Thabeet, Hibbert...no thank you. 3- I'll harp on it again and again: the Wolves' biggest 2 issues are eFG and a gigantic free throw discrepancy. In their wins, they average 19.3/25.1 FTA/M while shooting an eFG of 51.5%. In their losses, they average 13.7/18.9 with a 47.3eFG. Interestingly enough, the Wolves have essentially the same pace and FGA whether they win or lose; it's all about how well they shoot it. Their drop is an equal combination of 3s and 2s (-10.3/-10.8% drop off respectively). A poor shooting 7 footer who doesn't get to the line nearly as much as he should isn't the ideal fit for this club *with the top pick*. They had their chance last year to pick up a good rebounding, solid passing, hustling big in Noah and they blew it. This year doesn't have any Noah's to go around with the top pick (Robin Lopez might be worth a try if he's available at the top of the 2nd). The Wolves have clear functional needs that aren't necessarily tied to position. They have 1 legit NBA starter and the rest is up for grabs. Hope and pray and hope and pray that they can get Beasley; a guy who shoots for a high percentage, gets to the line a ton and can hit the offensive glass. He may have some defensive issues but (I'll tip my hand here on my view of centers) this year isn't the year to reach for a center just because the position needs to be filled. They need a second scoring option who can shoot well and get to the line more than they need a red-flag filled center who may or may not be anything more than a role player in the NBA. Here's another interesting stat: in their wins, the Wolves average 3.6 blocks/game. In their losses, they get 3.7. I understand the intimidation factor of having a big guy in the middle to shore up shoddy (Shaddy) perimeter D, but blocks are one of the most overrated stats there are. If the Wolves want a big, they should try their best to get someone like Darko, Andris Biedrins, or Bargnani in a trade. Shaddy would do well in Nellyball.
Jim (not verified)11:56am
Apr 16
I agree with this post, especially in regards to Beasley. People who say he'd be too redundant with Jefferson are wrong. He's the best prospect in this draft by far and could step on an NBA floor tonight and put up a 30-15 game at either forward position. Rose is a great prospect too but he's just not as good as Beasley. The Wolves have got to stop putting so much stock in NCAA tournament play and position needs and take the best overall player no matter what. What's needed is a second dynamic all-star-potential player. Using a top pick on an average big man like Lopez would be a crime.
McCleak (not verified)05:09pm
Apr 16
SNP, What do you think of Robin Lopez as an early 2nd round pick?
Stop-n-Pop (not verified)05:51pm
Apr 16
If Robin is available at the top of the 2nd round, I think he would be a good value pick. I don't think they could go wrong with R. Lopez, Devon Hardin, or Jason Thompson at the top of the 2nd round. I'm really rooting for Pat Calathes and Shan Foster with the top 2 2nd rounders. Both are big for their positions (Foster is a 6'6" 2 and Calathes is a legit 6'10" 3/4) and they can shoot the hell out of the ball. Plus, both are top notch character guys who have a high B-Ball IQ. They would make wonderful additions to the Wolves' bench. The chances of landing a good starter at the top of the 2nd round are pretty slim so I'm of the opinion that you look at your 2nd unit, team weaknesses, and go with guys that can perform well doing more limited tasks than would a 1st round pick. Think of it like football; the NFL has specialized every position to such an extent that the need vs. BPA equation kind of gets tilted towards need a bit more than in the NBA. In the case of the Wolves (and taking into consideration their long proven inability to find 2nd round gold), they should be looking for tall shooters who can force defenses to be honest for a few minutes per game. In the case of Lopez, Hardin, and Thompson, I think the team and fans wouldn't necessarily be getting what they thought they were getting, namely a starting 5 or a 5 who could play 20+ minutes along side Big Al. That being said, as of now they have two picks and they couldn't really go wrong with using one of them on a big player and one on a guy who can hit 3s. My hope is that they find someway to package the 2nd rounders and a player like Shaddy to move up into the teens so that they could get a player like CDR, Chase Budinger, or Joe Alexander (in that order); guys who can put the ball on the floor and hit open shots. Seeing that the Wolves have decided to sell a season ticket package that could end up costing less than a season's worth of Apple Valley Eagle High School games, here's another gimmicky idea that can give you an idea of what I'm talking about. I call it the Italian Option. It only works if they pick less than 2nd: 1- Draft Danilio Gallinari 2- Trade $2.8 mil trade exception + 2nd round pick to Golden State for Marco Belinelli 3- Trade Shaddy + Marko + other 2nd rounder + Celtic pick to the Raptors for Andrea Bargnani, Kris Humphries, and the Raptors' 2008 1st rounder (currently 17th; maybe sub Heat pick for Celts' one). 4- Take best available option between CDR, Budinger, Alexander. 5- Re-sign Bassy (3-4 years), Gomes (3-4 years), and Richard (1 year) 6- Attempt to move Brewer to Suns for Atlanta pick and additional considerations (they wanted him last year). Lineup: 1- Foye/Bassy 2- (CDR, Budinger, Alexander)/Belinelli/Brewer 3- Gallinari/Gomes/Brewer 4- Jefferson/Humphries 5- Bargnani/Richard Immediately, the Wolves become a much bigger and better shooting ball club. 6'7" at the 2 and 6'9" at the 3 provide the squad with a nice balance to where ever Jefferson ends up on the court. Belinelli and Humphries could come off the bench and provide shooting/scoring. Hey, if the Wolves are giving $1 tickets away and they can't even get 2,000 people to watch their commercial-free 1/2 games on TV, they need a new market. Why not be Italy's favorite team :) Plus, to be honest, I like that lineup a whole lot more than what they have now...especially if they could get Phoenix to bite on Brewer.
Wim (Belgium) (not verified)02:16am
Apr 17
Well, I defenitly agree on the praying for a TOP2 pick because I'm also not really sure whom to pick if we drop out of the top2. Say we don't trade anything, I also hope we do trade up a bit, but say we don't. Who would you really pick with our 3-5 pick somewhere. Gallinari? He does fit our functional need but is he really worth that high a pick? Most mock drafts seem to have him a lot higher nowadays... though he remains my close favorite for a "drop out of top2 and no trades" scenario. At least Brook would allow us to end the smallball we so dread. He's the only guy I can see playing alongside AL for 20+ minutes in this draft. Agreed, it might not be the time to reach for a center with the top pick (especially with all the value later on), but if we don't, I an see no other option than Gallinari with our nr3 pick. Would you feel 100% confident doing that? Or is there another option? Anthony Randolph does seem to have the defensive potential but I haven't seen him play this season, so I really don't know. What's your take on him s-n-p? He seems to come up with the draft machine a lot. Some say Mayo .. but if we get one more tweener sized guard with a 90%+ scorers mentality I think I'm gonna go root for the trail blazers (meheh just kidding ;)) .. dito Gordon. So .. I would say either we take a, granted, scary pick in Lopez and end the smallball or we take a chance on Gallinari and completely start throwing stuff around and start all over (don't really see the front office doing that...)... agree?
stop-n-pop (not verified)06:35am
Apr 17
I like Mayo's potential for the pro game. He played in a Tim Floyd offense with a bunch of poor jump shooters. I.E. he had many late-in-the-shot-clock shots and a poor stable of players to max out his assists with jumpers. Of course, if he comes to the Wolves, he'll have a Randy Wittman offense with a bunch of poor jump shooters so that's a concern, but he's got a nice jumper and can hit from range as well as possessing good court vision and the ability to get in the lane. His selection would likely spell the end of Bassy and the Wolves will have taken 3 relatively undersized guards and a 185 lbs tweener in the last 4 drafts while doing little to increase their overall size, but...well, it would be nice to draft in the top 2. If they fall down to 6 or 7 (the lowest they could go), I think they should suck it up and take CDR. At that point, Gallinari and Lopez should be off the board and they're looking at Kevin Love, Randolph, Eric Gordon, Deandre Jordan and Donte Green. CDR has size, can defend, and hit from in and out. I think he'd be a great addition as a 2nd scoring option at that point. Foye, CDR, Gomes, Jefferson, and ....well, that's another problem.
Andy G (not verified)08:53am
Apr 17
I like CDR, but two things worry me about his potential as a pro: 1) He's not a very comfortable catch & shooter. This is more important as an NBA 3, than it is college 3--(see Corey Brewer). Almost all of CDR's production in college was either in transition or off the dribble in the half-court, which leads me to concern #2... 2) He might not be athletic enough to dominate 1-on-1 like he did in college. He doesn't look to be extremely quick, or jump very high. He's got crafty moves, but a lot of his shots get blocked or altered when he's now facing guys bigger and quicker than him. I don't think either of these things mean we don't take him at some point, just that it might be high at 6 or 7.
Stop-n-Pop (not verified)06:08pm
Apr 17
I agree that he's probably a stretch at 6 or 7 but no more of a gamble than Anthony Randolph, Kevin Love, or Donte Green. I think that players like CDR and Budinger will actually do better in the pros with their dribble drive games than they did in college. Both of those players have the size, shot, and handle to create problems at the 2. His offensive game reminds me a lot of a right-handed version of Jalen Rose. Rose used to have a little running left handed push shot that was damn near unblockable. CDR has a few different shots where he really positions himself well against his defender in order to get off quick push shots on the drive. You don't need a ton of speed or athleticism if you can play well horizontally like CDR. However, I agree that he'd be a stretch at that point in the draft...which is why they would have to suck it up to a certain degree.
Andy G (not verified)11:51pm
Apr 17
And a Detroit product-nonetheless. I loved Jalen Rose, and I like CDR a lot too--my main point was just the draft position, since the mocks I've read have him down toward the mid-teens. His shot seems a little bit awkward, though--as evidenced by his free throw meltdown when he was short-arming them down the stretch against KU. If we got him later than 10, I'd be fine with that. He could be a very good pro.
Xand (not verified)10:15am
Apr 16
Yeah, it's fairly accurate. He's about the same size as his brother, in that he seems to be a legit 7' with good length, but he's a bit quicker than Brook and has much more of a defensive, dirty work mindset. In fact, relative to their projected draft positions I much prefer him to his brother. He's a guy I would REALLY like to try to pick up by maybe packaging our 2 second round picks (and change, if necessary) to move up a bit into the 1st round. He's not going to be sticking many (if any) jumpers, but he's a mobile, active 7 footer who'll clean the glass, agressively challenge shots and guard the opponents best big man, all of which sounds great to me from a late 1st round pick. It's also worth pointing out that he's shown some flashes of being able to score a little bit in the post during the tourney with some rudimentary post moves. While he lacks his brothers touch and scoring mentality, I don't think he's a complete lost cause in that area either.
Captain America (not verified)07:58am
Apr 16
The need for an effective center is obvious and has existed since the founding of the franchise. Unfortunately, the draft rarely provides immediate relief and there is no one in free agency this summer. Unless one invests in miracles, expect to read more about small ball next season.
gjk (not verified)11:18am
Apr 16
I go into this more in a post further down the page, but my disagreement with that is that it's not as important to have one effective center as it is to have enough players who can play there effectively in any situation. Preferably, they'll only need two of these players so they don't have to take up too many roster spots. I think they'll still want to play small ball next season in some situations; it's part of the reason they've won games against Phoenix and Golden State. Thinking about it that way, they just need an effective platoon, and there are players out there (Kurt Thomas, DeSagana Diop, Lorenzen Wright, to name a few) and on the team (Richard, Madsen) who could be part of such a platoon. They don't need Shaq in his prime; they need two guys who combine to play decently and have some variety of abilities.
Geoff (not verified)10:06am
Apr 16
Got a question for those who know more than me: We've had our fair share of draft busts or at least underachievers, be it Ebi or to lesser degrees Foye, Mccants and now Brewer. My question is, do you think these guys would be further along today if coached under a different staff? Basically does the T'wolves program in general not properly nurture young rooks to their potential? For example, would Roy be shlubbing it for the Wolves right now if we had kept him? To reiterate, are the Wolves just sucking at nurturing their young picks?
Keith Thomas (not verified)10:31am
Apr 16
Saw that Celts Assistant Tom Thibeadeau is being mentioned for the Bulls job and the Knicks job. Shame that it seems to be a given that Wittman is coming back next year. Thibeadeau gets raves as an assistant and is going to be a solid head coach. Something Wittman, with his smallball obsession and astoundingly bad Win Loss record, may never be. Dang
Andy B (not verified)11:32am
Apr 16
Last year Doc Rivers was considered by many to be a coach whose tenure was in jeopardy. Then KG and Ray Allen landed on his roster. Now he is in the running for coach of the year. Wittman or Thibeadeau? I don't think it makes much difference. First we need the players. Then we need improvement. Then we compete for the championship. As long as we progress towards that goal by taking the necessary steps along the way, we should stick with what we got for continuity's sake. We got Jefferson. We improved from the beginning of the year to the end. When the organization takes an obvious step back, then we should consider getting rid of Wittman.
Andy b (not verified)11:48am
Apr 16
Well, Not everyone agrees with me. http://www.minnpost.com/steveaschburner/2008/04/16/1532/wolves_wittman_is_getting_a_pass_--_and_shouldnt
Stop-n-Pop (not verified)05:58pm
Apr 16
I was surprised to find out that the Wolves haven't won 3 in a row under Wittman. The last time they did so was right before Casey was wrongly canned for the Country Club Affirmative Action hire. http://www.canishoopus.com/2008/4/15/399349/story-title It's pretty amazing how common at least one 3 gamer is for even the worst teams. Last night's loss to the Pistons ensured that it won't happen this year. Witt's last 3 gamer was a 6 game winning streak in Cleveland at the beginning of the 00-01 season.
jesse (not verified)12:04pm
Apr 16
Britt, What was the cause of the horrid defense last night? Was it the fact we went with the small ball? Or, are we just that bad on defense? I agree neither McCants nor Foye are good on defense. But at times McCants seems like he gets motivated and does a decent job. Though that scarily reminds me of how Ricky Davis handled his defensive assignments. Hold the Foye/McCants, sub in Rose. As much as I like those two, neither one has All Star written on them. And neither of them have the potential as this kid Derek Rose. Both have had serious injuries, and the long term is still unknown. I read one poster saying Rose wasn't a natural guard. I have to strongly disagree. All I have seen this kid do is run the point...to a plumb. He has superb ball handling skills, protects the ball, makes good decisions, and is an excellent passer. He controls tempo and set his guys up. And his defense is pretty darn good too. But let's just say you're right, and he's not a natural/true point guard. There is this guy in San Antonio, his name is Tony Parker and he plays basketball for the San Antonio Spurs... He has 3 championship rings. I'm just saying, there are many teams that don't have a true/natural/conventional point guard and do very well. Just because Minnesota can't get it to work doesn't mean that it doesn't. I would trade McCants and or Foye in a heart beat if we had the opportunity to draft Rose.Rose reminds me of Stephon Maubary. Pre-psycho star barry that is.
OLOWA-EBI (not verified)03:24pm
Apr 16
The Foye or McCants debate is like arguing whether McHale or Babcock should be running the team. They'll all have their flashes of success. But if you're looking for a space in the upper stratosphere of NBA teams, neither will get you there. And I don't think either will get you there as a member of a solid team, ala Detroit and Rip Hamilton. I have lately been feeling that I'm back believing, buying hope, and rooting for Christian Laettner and JR Rider. I remember thinking Laettner is a winner and JR is the most athletic shooting guard who can dunk over Ewing. Except for Big Al, there was been a Land of Oz belief that some of these young guys will take the next step. Except for Big Al, no one did. As if this isn't negative enough, the Timberwolves lottery ball failure casts a long shadow and our 10% or 15% chance this year at Beasley/Rose is likely to be more of the same. And then if we do get a top two pick, we'll depend on McHale to make the pick. I think all of the above is my perspective as a realist. If I were a pessimist I'd focus on the probability that even if the Wolves get Rose with the 1st or 2nd pick, then McHale keeps his job for another five years. Go Wolves
antonymous (not verified)11:09pm
Apr 16
I've been a bit absent from the blog as of late, though it holds a place dear to my RSS feed reader. I really appreciate not only Britt's writing, but also the comments and insight from everyone. The differing voices and opinions really make this blog wonderful, and a great spot for keeping up-to-date on our progress when I miss a few games. If you don't already know, I thought I'd drop some science regarding the Wolves season ticket promotion going on right now - you pay $1 per game if we get the first pick in the draft, $2 for the second pick, etc (up to $5 per game if we "lose" the lotto - that's a maximum total of $215 for the season). I'm a paycheck-to-paycheck kind of guy, but I can now say that I am a Wolves season ticket holder! I'm *so* excited! So there's my silver lining for the season :) Anyway, I've got much to weigh in on regarding the draft, but I'll weigh in on those respective threads. Even though our Wolves aren't in the playoffs, I have to say that this postseason is shaping up to be one of the best in recent memory - there's plenty of quality basketball to watch.
antonymous (not verified)11:21pm
Apr 16
Of course, the western conf matchups are finalized now - the matchups are good, of course (especially suns-spurs), but I was hoping New Orleans would get to face that Nuggets team and the Lakers would get one of their more "classic" foes (Dallas). I really like the Mavs odds against a relatively untested Hornets team - Kidd has the potential to expose or be exposed. Utah-Houston will be interesting mainly because Houston has the home court. It's going to be a great postseason.
Andy B (not verified)09:58am
Apr 17
I tuned into Channel 45 for the last Timberwolves game last night. With Jefferson on the bench in the 4th quarter I assumed the Wolves had decided to do the obvious tank job on the last game of the year to secure position 3 in the lottery ball order. Then when McCants blows the layup to win the game and force overtime I thought that the desire to lose was obvious. They come out to start overtime with Jefferson still on the bench and the writing was on the wall. The Wolves prefered ping pong balls to winning last night. Then Foye comes on and decides enough of this and pulls out the victory to salvage some positive karma for the team. I noticed something last night. It was just a little thing, but one of those things that my be indicative of a players character. Late in the thrid or early in the 4rth Brewer gets out on a break and gets a dunk to pull the Wolves within 3. As Milwaukee inbounds the ball Jaric comes from nowhere and steals the ball and then is fouled hard as he goes for a layup right in front of Brewer. Jaric goes to the floor and Brewer turns around and sees McCants coming up and he goes to him for a high five celebration of his dunk while Jaric is still on the flloor. McCants gives Brewer his five then rushes by him to offer Jaric help up from the floor. So, who is the player with the bad attitude? The one with the me-first, team second attitude? Brewer or McCants? As basketball karma goes, a few possessions later Brewer makes the steal and has a wideopen dunk that he doesn't finish. He's too tired to make it up over the rim.
Andy G (not verified)10:59am
Apr 17
One bright spot from this season on the statistical front: McCants and Foye both shot over 40% from 3 and were in the Top 20 in the NBA in that category. Of the Top 20, they are two of the youngest players in the group.
RhinoLove (not verified)11:51am
Apr 17
In case any of you haven't seen it...Bill Simmons has a great writeup on why KG is this year's MVP. I am in 100% full agreement. BTW, did anyone catch Hanny and Pete's commentary last night. They went out of their way (AGAIN!) to make the case that KG doesn't deserve either the MVP or Defensive Player of The Year. It's bad enough that we have to watch the Wolves struggle like this. Do we really need to have these two jackasses insult our intelligence on every broadcast as well? Look at the Celtics record last year vs. this year. Tell me how in the hell KG isn't the MVP. And tell me how you can praise Jefferson and Gomes ad nauseum when they played major roles on last year's sorry Celtics team. It doesn't add up.
Andy G (not verified)01:11pm
Apr 17
I didn't hear Hanny and Pete, but I'll tell you how KG isn't MVP. He should be third behind Kobe (1) and Paul (2). He's done a great job playing with 6-time All-Star Pierce, and 8-time All-Star Allen, in leading their defense while Pierce leads the offense. However, they fared well while he was hurt, even against good competition (went 7-2 with wins over Dallas and San Antonio), and his numbers don't even approach MVP-caliber (19 and 9). Kobe and Paul have been the dominant pieces on teams heading up a conference that is much more competitive than the East, and therefore deserve more recognition as MVP candidates. Between Paul and Kobe, I'd give a slight edge to Kobe since he's had to battle through two stretches without his starting center, and second-best player. I would imagine that if LA played the whole season with little or no injuries to Gasol and Bynum, they'd be sporting a record similar to the Celtics, but in the much tougher conference.
stop-n-pop (not verified)03:52pm
Apr 17
I thought J-Pete's comments about Camby deserving the Defensive Player of the Year award were especially stupid. I think his comment was something along the lines of "how could the guy who won it last year not win it this year if he had more rebounds and blocks?" Yikes. He probably had quite a few rebounds and blocks during Denver's 160+ point game against the Sonics. What goes unmentioned is that Denver got worse as a team on defense this year (nearly a whole point in def eff) while Boston won 30 more games largely due to a defense that improved its def eff by 8 points over last year's number. I repeat: 8 points. (Boston's off eff increased by 7 points thanks to Garnett's presence.) I don't understand what the argument is with the MVP debate. It's Garnett by a mile. Give Chris Paul the Most Improved Player award and let Kobe be happy with getting to the finals, but KG improved his team from 24 to 66 wins. Without him, they're a 45 win team. With him, they're the best team in basketball.
Andy G (not verified)04:19pm
Apr 17
"Without him, they're a 45 win team." No, they are actually a 7-2 team. This much was proven on the floor in February. 2-0 vs. the past two Western Conference Champions. Since the KG trade was the only major move for MN, and Boston also acquired another 8-time All-Star, a better measure of his impact is on our team. That would be 10 less wins this year. (15 or so if you bring in tanking). Significant, yes, but not the 42 that his fans are crediting him with, while ignoring all of Ray Allen's contributions, and the certain exponential benefit of meshing three Hall of Famers, each at a different position on the floor, and each still in (albeit the tail end of Allen's) of their primes. What would happen if LeBron and Dwight Howard joined Dwayne Wade on Miami? Let's say they trade Marion. My guess is that their win total would jump about 55 games to around 70. 3 Hall of Famers is a nice thing to have, especially in the current state of the league where the talent is pretty evenly distributed.
stop-n-pop (not verified)05:14pm
Apr 17
You can't take a 9 game stretch and project it out over an 82 game season. The Celts are tagged as a 45-52 win squad without KG and 68-74 with KG on a few projection stats (the 52/74 one is Pythagorean Win%). Basicaly, the gist behind stats like this is that you take his on/off numbers with off/def efficiency and calculate the standard deviation from non-KG team numbers and the league as a whole. When KG plays, the Celts average 114.8 points/100 possessions while giving up 98.1. When he sits, they average 106 and give up 102. You then take the differences and run them against league averages. All in all, he provides the team about 21 more victories/82 contests. This is just one method of assessing total value to the team. I think it's a bit aggressive (74 wins is kind of high-end) andfails to take into account differences from year to year. As for your 7-2 sample size, if you're a .600 team, you have a 88% chance of running off a single 7 game win streak during the season. Even without KG, it is not out of the norm (it's actually pretty common) for a 52 win squad to run off 7 in a row, thus insuring them of a 7-2 record over 9. I know that KG didn't play during that stretch, but you can't possibly extrapolate a KG-less Celtic season out of such a small sample, especially when it is so common among teams with similar winning percentages. Even if you drop them down to 45 wins, they have about a 50% chance of getting at least 1 7 gamer per year (they have a 70% chance of getting a 6 gamer...although not both). Another way to break this down even further is to break down KG's numbers against Ray Allen's and then compare them to Kobe and Pau or Paul and West. You'd compare KG's on/off eff numbers to Allen's, adjust for minutes and walk away with a number. You'd then use the percentage difference against KG's numbers against the league. Who gets more help from his friends? I don't know. What I do know is that KG is the best player on the best team in the league and he is the biggest difference between last year's 24 win team and this year's 66 win beast. Actually, there's a good article over at Real GM that argues that LeBron is the clear cut winner this year in terms of value to his team. I can't find the link right now, but it starts with off/eff differences and then adds in Pythagorean numbers as well as on/off numbers adjusted for minutes.
Andy G (not verified)05:37pm
Apr 17
I agree that 9 games isn't a ton, but it's what we have to look at--and not speculate about--when determining what Boston would look like without KG. They went 7-2 with wins over the past 2 West Champs. Nobody has any idea whether that would extrapolate accurately or not, since it's pure speculation. Mind you, though, that 7-2 is not only minus KG, but minus the Al Jefferson-Ryan Gomes combo that last year's crappy team had. That was just Pierce and Allen carrying the load. Perhaps Ray has still got it, and he's just taken a slight backseat the way one of the "Big 3" had to in order to make it work.
Stop-n-Pop (not verified)06:03pm
Apr 17
That certainly is a way to look at it. I ultimately think this will be a sort of make up year for Kobe. He went from demanding a trade to leading his squad to the Western Conference title in probably the toughest conference in league history. I'd argue against the pure speculation aspect of what you're saying as on/off court numbers based on efficiency are a pretty accurate way of determining worth over long periods of time (82 games and/or 100 possessions) but...well, to each his own. Here's another interesting comparison that Wolves fans should think about with all the talk about the need for a defensive center to play along side of Big Al: how well did he perform with Leon Powe? I haven't looked at it yet but it would be interesting to see how the 5 man units, on/off numbers and +/- stats work out when they were on the court together.
RhinoLove (not verified)07:48am
Apr 18
Andy, Part of the reason why KG deserves the MVP is his lifting of the team's level of play. Tell me with a straight face that having a very motivated KG has not made these guys play harder, practice harder and improve their games....DRASTICALLY. Take it a step further. Would this team have gone 7-2 in KG's absence if he hadn't raised their level of play already? My point is KG was on the bench, but his footprint was still all over that team.
Andy G (not verified)08:02am
Apr 18
I agree with that, and that's part of the reason he's one of the top few players in the game. I just don't think that, among that group, it's a quality unique to Garnett. I think Kobe sets the bar just as high, or higher, by being so driven to succeed and win each night. This, in my opinion, has helped develop the depth of the Laker roster that people talk so much about. He was immature with the Bynum stuff earlier in the year, but just like Jordan and KG occasionally get violent with teammates, it was one act that comes with getting pissed at lackluster play by guys you know are better than that. I'm not saying KG doesn't make a case for MVP, just that the guys with considerably better numbers on teams that fared very well in the better conference should get the nod. KG can take some credit for Pierce returning to All-NBA form, but I think Pierce deserves most of the credit for that--I think just the presence of having hope again had more to do with it than anything unique to KG's game or leadership. As for guys like Big Baby Davis and Leon Powe--he probably had a more direct impact. The 7-2, how would they have done without KG? stuff is probably too tough to tell--I was just harping on it since the biggest case for KG is the turnaround, and I was trying to point out that A) Pierce + Allen = a pretty damn good team in the Eastern Conference; and B) they showed that for a 9-game stretch, including two games over top-notch Western teams. It's just one factor to consider, like all the others.
Andy B (not verified)04:22pm
Apr 17
I'm not sure who is most deserving but I think there is an argument to be made for Kobe or Paul over KG starting with the West vs. the East. All three are deserving, if you ask me. I also am not sure why the improvement in wins should have aney bearing on MVP vs. just the overall number of wins. I mean, next year, Boston might have 68 wins and would you not consider KG for MVP because he only improved his teams wins by 2 wins. Silly question, I know. But, even with all the hype about Boston's improvement, I'll still listen to someone tell me tha Duncan is more valuable to SA success than KG is to Boston's. It just might be true.
Will Lose for Pat Riley's Balls (not verified)07:47pm
Apr 17
I agree with you Rhino, but all of this seems like a pointless exercise considering we have no say in the matter. Stats can be very deceivig. Denver has the best steal and block stats and are in the top 5 for rebounds. Yet they are last in points allowed. Boston is in the top 5 for steals, but that's their only top 5 defensive category. They are also in the top 5, along with the Wolves, for number of fouls. Yet they are 4th best in points allowed. And who has the best record, the best turn-around season in history, and beat the Lakers both times they played? I'm not aware of Boston, Peirce, or Allen being recognized for their defense prior to this season.
jesse (not verified)01:46pm
Apr 17
Rhino love, I think Jim and Tom also noted the age old debate: Is it Most valuable player for the team and the team's success? Or is it Most Valuable player in the League? I will say that KG is the MVP of the Boston Celtics. But keep in mind, he's not a 1 man team there like he was in Minnesota. He has 2 other super stars and a damn good bench and an up and coming point guard. He is surrounded by a lot more talent than he was here. Also, if you were to go by the numbers he put up alone, KG wouldn't even be in the mentioning. Should he be in the running for MVP? Yes, of course. But is he the strongest candidate? Probably not. To me, the question for the deserving MVP winner is a combination of to the league and to the team. Because of this I do look at Chris Paul and Kobe Byrant ahead of KG. But I don't say that KG is undeserving of the MVP award. I just don't think he's the strongest candidate. Regarding Brewer not helping Jaric up...yes I did notice how McCants ran to help him up. I don't know, but I don't think Brewer knew that Jaric was down for so long. And the dunk from about the free throw line was hilarious...Pete said "He thought he was Doctor J" hahaha that was too funny. He got denied by the RIM! lol
Andy b (not verified)02:27pm
Apr 17
I agree with the sentiments for Kobe and Paul and also that KG is deserving but behind those two. I know the playoffs don't count, but I might feel differently after the playoffs or maybe not. I was embarassed for Brewer. I didn't think he took off from that far away, certainly not the free throw line - more like the three-second arc. His steps were just a little off and he didn't have the strength to get up there when he needed it. Its a symptom of what he has shown to be lacking all season - strength. I think Brewer is lacking the much needed strength to compete on the NBA level and it affects all aspects of his game. The guy just does not have the power to get it done on so many levels right now. I have never seen someone look as weak as he does at times. Jaric went down right in front of him and he walked away. No big deal and i might mean nothing more than he was a little psyched up and thought Jaric could get up by himself, but... SOmething about it seemed a little strange. I'm not sure what it means, but my opinion of Brewer has fallen quite a bit over the year for reasons that go far beyond that little mishap.
RhinoLove (not verified)03:16pm
Apr 17
Yes, the Celtics added Ray Allen as well, but they also lost Al Jefferson and Ryan Gomes (two guys which Hanny and Pete are trying to convince us are cornerstones). They also added more than 40 (40!, 40!) wins. You need to read Simmons article, but to paraphrase...Boston's bench was viewed as being extremely thin before the season started. Rondo and Perkins were question marks, their defense sucked...etc. Garnett turned those bench guys into great role players. He breathed confidence, professionalism, and heart into the entire franchise. He let his numbers slide for the sake of winning and convinced others to do the same. Would this Celtics team even be in the playoffs had they just picked up Ray Allen? Maybe, by a hair. Instead, they added Garnett and have the league's best record, and pretty much dominated the entire frigging season. I can totally see the arguments for the other guys. They are not undeserving, I just think KG is more deserving. But, what really irks me is hearing Hanny and Pete go out of their way to say that Garnett should not be the MVP. Their ham handed attempts to convince fans that the Wolves got the best end of the trade just make me want to puke.
Andy G (not verified)03:36pm
Apr 17
That article brought out the worst in Simmons: his Kobe-hatred and Boston homerism. Boston flatout tanked last year, perhaps as much as anyone ever has, trying to get Oden. Pierce sat 35 games. They played 10-11 guys a night, regardless of who was playing well--Simmons himself reported this all of last year. That's not to say that they would've won a ton more games, but it sounds like decent coaching and a semi-inspired Pierce could've added 10-15 wins. Add Ray Allen, there's another 10. Swap KG for AJ and Gomes, and there's another 15-20. 15-20 is a lot, and that's why he's deserving of 3rd in the MVP votes. I agree that KG inspires teammates, and he does it in classy ways (usually--not sure about that punching Rick Rickert incident)--but it's not like Kobe and CP3 don't do the exact same thing. Just like David West isn't an All-Star without Paul, Farmar, Sasha and Bynum don't make their big strides without the most competitive athlete on the planet setting the bar for what's expected out of them. He doesn't look friendly doing it, but Kobe's the guy you'd want before any of em, and he's shown that this season.
Will Lose for Pat Riley's Balls (not verified)10:35pm
Apr 17
Complete with replay. Nice stat sheet padding. A steal, an offensive rebound, and 0-2 FG. Definitely a full step beyond the line. What's funny is he had enough steam left to completely throw it over the rim and go after another rebound. I'd like to see the Jaric play. http://youtube.com/watch?v=0NeQAngGLjo
Collin (not verified)04:02pm
Apr 17
Maybe we could land Joey Dorsey early in the second round. He's a bit shorter at 6'9'' than we might like, but he does two things we desperately a need a player to do. He rebounds, and he blocks shots. Unlike Love, who may be limited defensively in the NBA, Dorsey has the athleticism to defend above the rim, play help defense, and defend the pick and roll. He kinda reminds me of an uninjured theo ratliff. He'd fit into small ball and give us a post presence at the same time without needing the ball in his hands to change the course of the game. Sure, he sucks offensively and at the free throw line, but he wouldn't be the first effective post player to lack those skills.
jesse (not verified)04:36am
Apr 18
Why has no one talked seriously about Chris Douglas Roberts (CDR)? He reminds me of Brandon Roy, but a friend of mine said he reminded him of Josh Howard. Either way, this guy seems like he has the whole package.
Wim (Belgium) (not verified)06:38am
Apr 18
"Why has no one talked seriously about Chris Douglas Roberts (CDR)?" You gotta be kiddin' right? S-n-p has been hinting he would fix some of our difficiensies (hum..) and suggested making some kind of trade to try and get him in the lottery a while. We're discussing him all the way to the bottom; see you there :)
Jim (not verified)10:25am
Apr 18
If CDR's team hadn't played in the championship game no one would be suggesting the Wolves should get him. He's fun to watch in college but overrating guys who have success in the tourney is what got the Wolves to blow a top 10 pick on Brewer. There's probably 6-8 guys at his position that are better NBA prospects than CDR.
stop-n-pop (not verified)10:58am
Apr 18
we've been talking about him for a while here. him and budinger.
gjk (not verified)11:45am
Apr 18
I agree. I used to do the same thing when watching college players. Productivity and/or team success in college doesn't translate to success in the pros if the players don't have a broader set of skills and/or a lot of athleticism; it's why a guy like Rasheed Wallace has been a better pro than Joe Smith, and they played the same number of years in the same conference. If he was there in the second round, then they should consider him, but he doesn't offer the team anything that they don't already have.
secres (not verified)10:20am
Oct 21

Jean Shop Online is the best online Jeans Shop where you can buy the discount True Religion ,Fast shipping,lower True Religion Jeans price.True Religion Men Jeans True Religion Women Jeans True religion Women Crops True religion Women Shorts True Religion Jeans

Post new comment

The content of this field is kept private and will not be shown publicly.
  • Web page addresses and e-mail addresses turn into links automatically.
  • Allowed HTML tags: <a> <em> <i> <b> <strong> <cite> <code> <ul> <ol> <li> <dl> <dt> <dd> <img> <br> <p>
  • Lines and paragraphs break automatically.

More information about formatting options

CAPTCHA
By entering in the words in the captcha image, you help us prevent automated spam submissions and keep the site tidy.

Blogs

Sports

Baseball:
Warning Track Power by Alex Halsted
Sports:
On the Ball by Britt Robson

Society

Weather:
Dude Weather by Jimmy Gaines

A&E

Fiction:
Write Now! by Terry Faust

Retired

Hockey:
Spazz Dad by Todd Smith
Style:
Hook & Eye
Misc:
Is This News?
Fiction:
Yo, Ivanhoe by Brad Zellar
Food:
Consider the Egg by Stephanie March
Wine:
Beyond the Cask
Food:
Food Fight!
Media:
To the Slaughter
Misc:
Outrage by Staff
Food:
Chef's Table
Guest Commentary:
Just Passing Through
Humor:
Spazz Dad by Todd Smith
Cars:
Road Rake by Chris Birt
Commentary:
Read Menace by Tom Bartel
Society:
The Adventures of Melinda by Melinda Jacobs
Politics:
Defenestrator by Rich Goldsmith
Food:
Breaking Bread by Jeremy Iggers & Ann Bauer
Books:
Cracking Spines by Max Ross
Music:
Hear, Hear by Staff
Art:
The Vicious Circle by 6 Critics
Secrets:
Secrets of the Day by Kate Iverson
Theater:
Seen in the City by Staff
Film:
Talk About Talkies by Staff