Dude Weather Subscribe to Secrets Minneapolis / St. Paul
On the Ball
Open Thread: Create Your Own Trey
Actually this is just a more prominent way of letting folks know I'm overwhelmed with a looming deadline on another story and won't be able to make the Wolves game tonight--or even see it until tomorrow or Friday.
So if anyone wants to fill in with their impressions--it can be a trey of your own making, a couple of lines, or maybe focusing on one aspect of the game, as AK proposed a few weeks ago--I'd appreciate it. And if you don't feel like it, well, I'm shocked that you don't want to work for free.
In any case, I won't be posting. But--unless this story really stays a Gordian knot--I should be back to look at Friday's home tilt versus Denver.
61 Reader Comments
I'd love to do it. Do you want all of us to put something in the comments and then pick out the highlights in an update?
S&P--
It is a real dilemma: I think anyone who takes the time to chip in their own thoughts instead of just responding to mine deserves credit. But I don't want to be a position of judging the caliber of analysis on a game I myself won't get to watch for a couple of days, by which time there will be another one to peruse.
And what that means, I guess, is that the comments themselves will have to be the writer's own reward. (Feel free to backtrack on your original commitment.) Aside from my sincere gratitude, of course, which together with $1.85 will get you a medium roast at Urban Bean (and a scowl from the server for not leaving a tip).
As I've said on many occasions, the best impetus for me writing On The Ball (and Hang Time before that when I was at citypages.com) is the quality (and immediacy) of the feedback I get from smart readers. That said, nobody is obligated to contribute to the conversation, especially when I'm the one who has dropped out for this game. At the same time, I really do believe there is sufficient juice among my readers for an attractive, intelligent analysis of the Wolves' play even when I'm not around. And I wanted to create this open thread to provide folks with that opportunity, should they want to chime in.
Folks,
For your own sanity...plunk down the money and get the League Pass. We can still enjoy quality hoops and cheer for our favorite Wolf (KG). After a couple of games, you can pretend you've been a Celtics fans for years.
I am not kidding. It is a joy to see KG happy and playing with some quality players. It'll take your mind off the latest Wolves blowout and remind how good NBA hoops can be. The only downside is you'll quickly realize how royally screwed we got in the trade.
Rhinolove is correct. I watched the entire fourth quarter of the Celtics game last night while taking a well-deserved break from the Wolves game. KG had a huge game (especially in the fourth quarter). I believe he had 11 points in the last seven minutes and played excellent defense on Yao. It was fun to watch, even though I grew up absolutely hating the Celtics.
I have two questions about this franchise
1. What are the dynamics in the front office? Now that things are run by the coalition of the willing (McHale, Stack, Hoiberg, ?) how are disagreements handled. Given the absurd loyalty that Taylor has shown to McHale, would Hoiberg dare make a serious counterpoint to a McHale error in judgement?
2. Less seriously, what would have to happen during this season for Wittman to get fired? Short of Wittman losing it and embarrassing the franchise by literally dressing down his players on the court, is there some measure of basketball futility that would result in his firing? Perhaps a league-record losing streak?
Anyone know what the Celtics record was last year with Al Jefferson and without Paul Pierce? Is that when they went on the gigantic losing streak? This may provide evidence in favor of Wittman. Last year Doc Rivers also got endless flack for changing up his rotation constantly and not sticking with any of these guys. Maybe that's because few of them deserve consistent playing time?
Nate,
Question 1- no clue about the mgmt dynamics, but given the results, you can bet that they are highly dysfunctional with generous sprinklings of outright incompetence.
Question 2- Firing Wittman would be an open admission that the wheels have fallen off and we have made no progress this season. Although, even the most casual observer could see that if they looked at our record and the increasing point spread in our losses of late. Bottom line, we are not fooling anybody with this putrid rebuilding effort, and it makes a ton of sense to cut our losses ASAP and try something different.
Yes, the Celtics went on their huge tailspin with PP out of the line up.
I have been taking subtle swipes at Big Al all season, but I am now officially going on the record to say that he is a selfish, one dimensional player who has no interest in passing, playing defense, or showing any inkling of leadership to help make his teammates better.
He is the worst 20-10 guy in the league, he will never be an all-star because he can only put up these numbers on a bad team, and the Celtics are laughing their asses off because they knew this all along.
I second that. Jefferson's always whining, always looking like he thinks he's better than everyone else. In reality, he's accomplished nothing of note on the court. Being the best player on a team that's 4-27 or whatever it is is not an accomplishment. Being one of six players traded for one of the best ever is not an accomplishment. Having above-average stats on a terrible team last year is not an accomplishment. Padding your stats throughout four quarters is not an accomplishment. He is not a star, and I don't think he'll ever be the best player on a good team because he's gotten too used to trying to get his on a bad team so people don't think he's as bad as those surrounding him. Man, it's ugly right now, and Jefferson's behavior makes me wonder if he's can be part of a solution or if he's always going to be part of the problem.
Newsflash--Jefferson *is* better than everyone else on this team.
RhinoLove I always enjoy your stuff but I think you need a little perspective on this issue. For starters, check the assist to turnover ratio of your boy Craig Smith versus Jefferson. The biggest black hole on the team is hardly the 20-12 guy. Smith plays nearly 2/3 of Jeff's minutes but has less than half the rebounds, about 1/4 of the assists, and more than half the turnovers. And when Jefferson can play beside a legitimate center, he is a better defensive power forward than Smith.
Flandango--Grabbing 4.3 offensive rebounds per game and shooting 49.3% in the face of relentless double-teams is a hell of a way to pad your stats. As for being surly about not getting the ball, I don't see Jeff snarling at Craig Smith, who's shooting 54.5%; but at Telfair, McCants, Brewer, Jaric, etc., the guys who clank open looks more frequently than he clanks shots with two guys hanging all over him.
No question Jefferson's defense remains a liability, and no, I won't defend his effort there, because I do think he needs more balance. If you watch carefully, you'll notice that he has extended the range on his jumper and learned to pass better out of double-teams thus far this season. There is no reason why he can exert similar diligence in improving the fundamentals of his defense. But if I'm listing things wrong with the Wolves, Al Jefferson's name isn't even on the first page.
All true Britt. However, we didn't trade the greatest player in team history for Craig Smith or sign him to a near max contract. Nor is the management trying to sell Craig Smith as the centerpiece of this new team. Nor is everyone discussing how we should build around Craig Smith.
Forget Craig Smith, you could insert any other player on the team in the above paragraph. This isn't about Craig vs. Al.
Al Jefferson is our most talented player, no arguments. But, we are a terrible team, and Al isn't nearly as good as his stats would suggest. I'll go so far as to say we'd have a better record without him, and I knowing what I know now, I'd have rather we took any of the deals on the table for KG than we one we went for.
The guy doesn't understand team basketball and he doesn't seem committed anything beyond his own stat line. At the same time we've made a big financial commitment to him and are looking to him to lead this team. It's a sham, and I am calling bullshit.
My apologies on the numerous typos...I am getting worked up.
Easy RL,
I enjoy your comments as well. Nothing to get worked up over. We have a mild disagreement about something all us oddball Wolve's fan care about. I respect that you are calling out Jefferson and have placed some faith in Rhino. Your points are well taken and, given my track record (check back in the archives and see my discussion with Krush on Jefferson/Smith frontcourt), may even eventually persuade me to your side of the fence. Don't let yourself get too worked up.
Its all good. :)
Hey, just kidding about getting worked up. I was just making excuses for my spotty editing.
I realize that I am very hard on Jefferson. I am just disgusted that all we ended up getting for KG was him and cap relief. And I resent the team's efforts to persuade us that it was anything less than a fleecing.
You're right, we can't compare him to KG, who was the kind of player that comes along once per franchise history.
I stand by my comments, but I am not as angry as I seem...just disgusted :)
I agree that we won't be giving Portland/Utah/Seattle a run for their money in the next five years if Big Al is our best player, however here's a quick reminder: We didn't win much with KG as our best player. Yes, I define "not winning much" as one trip out of the first playoff round in the Ticket's tenure here. For my $$$, I'll take the 22-year old and the draft picks (*crossing fingers for lottery luck and an OJ Mayo/Foye backcourt*).
I think Al Jefferson can be better on defense but don't think he's ever going to be known for it. Somewhere I saw a comparison of KGs stats last year and Jeffersons this year and the side note said that we haven't lost that much. Staying in front of your man so they pass will never show up in your stats but it is the single thing that only three or four players on this roster have any concept of. Two, if you limit yourself to those that play.
Our best hope here is the draft (tho I like Rose more than Mayo, who I see as Starbury II), but it's depressing to be talking about it two days after the new year. Britt mentioned "Tanking in December" in the "suffocating hope" piece but I still stand behind tanking by roster. GG was supposed to be a piece the celtics were reluctant to give up, and that makes our 07-08 year as much of a swingman tryout as last year was. Thank God for Telfair, because it looked like we were entering the season without a PG at all on the roster (Foye being a 2).
And speaking of Foye, I've eased up a little on the ROY/Foye comparisons. Roy would have struggled to get off the bench here with Marko and Davis ahead of him. The draft pick made a bunch of sense, and even this year, we would be wondering about Roy's abilities as he split time on this roster, as fudged up as that is.
RL's making an intriguing argument I think. When the trade happened some people wondered whether AJ was as good as advertised because all his gaudy numbers were put up on a terrible Celtics team. Now he's putting up huge numbers again, but on a historically bad team. He's not getting a lot of help, of course, but I do think it is hard to say how good AJ really is in terms of being someone a team can build around. He is not the kind of player who makes team mates significantly better, and his defense may well be a problem that can't be totally fixed with more effort/better coaching. He has proven he can score in the paint and rebound and is a starting caliber player. That's one helluva a lot more than any other Wolf has shown. But it's fair to question whether he can be the best player on a good or even average NBA club. It seems ridiculous to rip the best player on the team, but if AJ was truly an elite NBA player, wouldn't the Wolves have won at least a couple more games so far? It's an interesting question I think, because as RL points out, Big Al is the one and only thing this franchise has left to sell.
I think that anyone who free gives away accolades to Al as an equal or potential equal to KG has to be out of their minds. However, I also think calling Al selfish and implying that their was some well known secrets that Celtic management knew about the fallibilities of Big Al leading them to the conclusion that he would never be an All star and he was and is a born loser is equally dubious.
Al is a very good power forward that is forced to play out of position at the c enter spot the mojority of his minutes on the floor. He is surrounded by players worse than any collection the Wolves ever managed to put around KG. Noone can shoot other than the enigma, a young athletic player who doesn't recognize a good shot from a bad one and the aging Walker. The best player on the roster next to him hasn't played a minute. The only player who could help him on defensive end is likely out for the year. He is double and triple teamed in the post and still manages double-doubles (granted, while losing).
Al Jefferson isn't the problem with this collection of Wolves. He is not the solution, but he is far from a problem needing to be addressed other than finding players around him who can play. Right now, Al Jefferson is the only NBA player on the roster who is not injured.
Al plays terrible, lazy defense. He is an adept scorer but his points come at the expense of ball movement and getting other players involved. He frequently berates teammates when he doesn't get enough touches, and his facial expressions and body language suggest that he is perpetually disgusted with his team. Is that enough supporting evidence to remove the dubious tag from my selfish comment?
As far as my claim that he only puts up numbers on bad teams...look at the track record. If he were truly a game changing, team improving, star player how in the hell could his teams have lost this many games?
The guy could be a good player, but he needs to be called out badly. His attitude, his defense, and his selfishness on offense are all hurting us right now. We could have gotten 20 pts a night from Rick Davis at a fraction of the price.
Everything you say may be true, but he's still the only thing the wolves got right now. You can call him out for showing up his teammates. You can call him out for his lack of defensive effort. You might get improvements on both ends by doing so. But An Al Jefferson playing great defense while supporting instead of berating teammates (a dubious accusation, I believe, but whatever) still will not get this team anymore wins until he's surrounded with some other NBA players.
Als not KG. He is not even close to KG. But, that don't make him selfish. Put some players around him, then we can determine how selfish he is. Until then, he's all we got.
Good to see that you've finally admitted that Jefferson is out of position at C. Better late than never. However, the idea that one would have to be "out of his mind" to see Jeff as a *potential* equal to KG is short sighted.
At the same point in there careers, here are how there stats stack up:
KG: 20.8 points, 10.4 rebounds, 4.3 assists, 1.7 steals, 1.8 blocks
AJ: 20.3 points, 12.3 rebounds, 1.4 assists, 1.1 steals, 1.3 blocks
They both have there strengths and weakness (many of KG's were glossed over while he was here, but he's got them), play different type of games, and were at similar stages of development.
A common error many people make is comparing AJ, who should be a senior in college, to KG in his prime.
I also wonder if Jefferson will ever be a great all around player (chances are he won't because hardly anyone is), but he's only part of the problem on this squad.
The one thing that does piss me off about Jefferson, however, is his repeated failure to get back on defense. That has nothing to do with playing out of position. It doesn't even take that much intelligence (in contrast with some defensive concepts). The man needs to set an example for this team and that's an easy place to start. If I were coaching I would talk to Al about this and really emphasize it.
***beginning of Nate's coaching fantasy
Al, you're doing great. But if you want to be great, you've got to hustle and get back on defense every single time. In fact, that's all I want from you these next three games, just get back on defense every single time. I don't care if you don't pass out of double teams or if you fail to rotate on defense properly, I just want you to run back on defense these next three games. If you don't do it once, you'll get a verbal note from me, if you don't get back twice, you're out of the game. I'm not talking about anyone else on this team, I'm talking about you, Al. You get back on defense, I don't give a shit if Antoine Walker doesn't get back on defense. Toine is not a leader and he's certainly not great. You can be great, Al, show me that you want to be great and that you want to be leader. Help me show this team how to win.
***end of Nate's coaching fantasy
I would do the same thing with Foye and Brewer. And really, only these three. If they want to be leaders they need to step up. If by the end of the year Big Al is back on defense 99% of the time, the team has made some progress.
While I don't have the extra cash for League Pass, I will say I've made sure to catch the Celtics when they've been on ESPN or TNT. Same with the Pistons, since I was probably as big a fan of Flip and Chauncey as I was KG. And RhinoLove is right that it is enjoyable to see KG doing so well in Boston, even if it stirs regret of what might have been.
And just wanted to chime in with an apology for the disjointed nature of my comments last night. It was a little tough navigating that stuff from my BlackBerry while also trying to keep an eye on the game. :-)
I am at the game and it's 23-18 Blazers after one quarter. Big Al leads the Wolves with 9 points and 3 boards. Gomes has probably been the next most productive player so far and actually drove to the basket to get to the free throw line! It took Shaddy not even a minute to commit his first silly foul, drawn by Roy, who along with Aldrige, is pretty much doing whatever he wants.
At halftime, Wolves are trailing 52-42, largely due to allowing someone named James Jones to go 5/5 from the field, including 3 threes. Wolves are not hitting shots and are letting the Blazers control the boards. It's actually a bit surprising they are not trailing by more...
Third quarter ends with the Wolves trailing 75-62. They did some good things to actually cut the lead to about four, but their inability to finish quarters reared it's ugly head again. And no sign of Chris Richard yet, though he'd probably match up better against Portland's young bigs than Rhino, who has four fouls in 15 minutes, or Toine, who has been a sieve in his 16 minutes.
With 8:30 left in the final quarter, Rhino just got whistled for his fifth foul in 16 minutes on the floor, plus a T after slamming the ball down in frustration. I'd be frustrated too if I were being asked to defend guys like LaMarcus Aldridge and Channing Frye, who are a good six inches taller than me, with much longer arms to boot. I don't mean to single out Rhino too much since he does have 8 points and 5 boards so far, but it does reinforce the mismatch that comes from having Rhino and Big Al on the floor together too much.
Final score is 90-79, Blazers. Fourth quarter largely consisted of Big Al padding the stats to finish with 29 points and 16 boards. Since nobody else could hit a shot, I guess I can't blame him. I'd say the main number that stood out for me was the 9 assists the Wolves had for the game, or one more than Sergio Rodriguez had for Portland, though I'll admit their total of 17 was not exactly awe-inspiring, either.
I did try to watch Gerald Green when he got on the floor and he definitely demonstrated his poor shot selection, though it came mostly in garbage time, so I'm not sure how much to hold it against him, but it does seem like one more thing Wittman should have to justify in how Green is getting minutes when Richard never got off the bench.
So much for New Year's Resolutions....
Since 31 games in we are already discussing the offseason, let me react to the two big whoppers our man Jim Pete offered in tonight's broadcast. It's really the reason why the gent should be working for the Republican National Committee. As the peeps down in Dinkytown back in the day used to say: "no one can lay down the spin like my man Jim".
The first whopper was the consistent mention throughout the game into the post-game Wolves Live of the need to acquire jump shooters in the offseason.
What!?!
You mean the team that can't play a lick of defense or share the ball needs to focus it's efforts on acquiring perimeter shooting? Seems to me that the first order of business is to find players who will play tough, aggressive D that would help create easy baskets at the offensive end. The second order of business would be to actually find players who make it a goal to have 20-25 assists per game. The Blazers had just 17 tonight, but our team only had 9. A point guard who could dribble penetrate and actually finish would be helpful here.
The second, more egregious comment was the statement (and I'm paraphrasing here) that fans should have enjoyed the 40 to 58 win seasons more while it lasted. Let me see if I have this straight; I should have celebrated the fact that we lost a number of our first round draft choices on a botched, illegal free agent signing, or enjoyed the awful to mediocre draft choices and other free agent signings we did make during that period? Or, been satisfied with the notion that despite having a top 5 baller on our squad for over a decade, we could only get past the first round once? Well, pardon my ingratitude.
Part of being a good to great organization is learning from your mistakes. I don't think these folks have learned anything. Comments like these give me indigestion, although I will say it keeps me watching the broadcasts. I just hope Petersen doesn't ever say McHale should be greeted as a liberator.
Peter:
I've noticed the creeping "we need better guards" talk as well. I'm hoping this doesn't translate into yet another 6 nothing combo guard in the draft. Who am I kidding?! I'm pre-ordering my Eric Gordon Wolves jersey right after posting this response. I can hardly wait for the Brewer, Smith, Jefferson front court next year. Mmmmmmm....good times.
What's pathetic is that Jim Pete is right. After collecting all these 2/3s, they haven't found one guy who is a starting quality player on a good team or even an above-average outside shooting role player. At some point they are going to have to bring in guys who can shoot. The team has bigger problems than shooting, but at this point everything on the team is a problem. All they have is a 4 (Al Jeff) and a backup 4 (rhino). It's too bad McCants and GG don't seem to be taking their play seriously enough to stay in this league, but if they blow their opportunity this year, it's hard to see the case for giving them another chance. People are pleased with Telfair, but how many playoff teams have backup point guards who are inconsistent and can't shoot? Brewer may develop into an all-around game changer, but he's not going to be a scorer. Jaric is good enough to be a change of pace off the bench and little else. Walker's a nice guy. It's unclear whether Foye can be a starter on a playoff team at any position. So yea, I agree with Jim Pete for once, the Wolves have to bring in capable jump shooters — in addition to everything else they need, including general manager, coach and owner.
I don't even know what to say. The Wolves did so many things wrong it's baffling.
Every team in the league has at least DOUBLE the wins we've got. I knew we would suck, but never in my wildest dreams did I think we would be this colossally bad.
At least my boy Gomes has had a few good games in a row now. Highly doubtful that he resigns with us, which is a shame. I'd rather have him than most of the guys on this "team."
McCants is horrible. I feel a little vindication after getting ripped by everyone after voicing my displeasure with McCants and his game the past two seasons.
Gerald Green is clueless.
In the Wolves season previews I wrote this off-season, I said the biggest question going into the season was going to be in regards to Wittman figuring out a set rotation and/or pecking order. It's so blatantly obvious that he has come nowhere near doing so. I mean, Chris Richard starts and then gets DNP's. Doleac goes from DNP's to starting. Players can play 5 minutes one game and then 25 the next. It's baffling. Britt pointed out all the players averaging 20 minutes per game, what a gong show. Lastly, everyone on our team has started at least one game this season except Gerald Green. WHAT is going on????
Sorry for the ranting, just frustrated with our Front Office/Coach.
Cross posted here:
http://www.canishoopus.com/blogs/stopnpop/2008/01/02/canis-trey
The Three Pointer: Boobery, Bullshiite, and the Hard Bigotry of No Expectations
Game #31, Home Game #14: Minnesota 79, Portland Trailblazers 90
Season record: 4-27
1. Fouling for Pleasure
There are many, many things that are wrong with our beloved Puppies. From the lack of a consistent perimeter threat to important injuries, there are no shortages of things to nag about. However, the two most pressing and important deficiencies for the Blue and Gold are their lack of a true center and their massive free throw disparity.
In a way, the free throw gap (not to be confused with the gap at center court before the game) is the most destructive portion of the Wolves’ game. By allowing nearly 8 more free throws per game to their opponents, the Wolves’ d is put in a hole so deep that even when it holds an opponent to 45% shooting from 2, 0% shooting from 3, and only 7 offensive rebounds (as it did against the woeful Clippers), it simply can’t find a way to win.
A big part of the problem with the loss to the Clips was that the Pups were fouling people 70 feet away from the basket. The 2 main culprits in the far-away hackathon were Rashad McCants and Craig Smith. I’ll give these 2 the benefit of the doubt by pretending that the fouls were the result of good defensive intentions gone bad; after all, according to pre-game analysis by Jim Pete and the newly minted Paul Allen, one of the keys to victory over the Blazers was to play aggressive defense without hacking the guy with the ball. Again, I’m not sure what defensive aggressiveness has to do with swinging wildly at an opponents arm 70 feet away from the bucket, but I’m willing to extend the benefit of a doubt.
Against the Blazers the Wolves performed admirably in the battle of free throws. 20 makes to the Blazers’ 22 is pretty good for this team and they even kept the FTAs within a reasonable 2 shot margin (25-27). Unfortunately, this game exposed a secondary issue that is growing out of the free throw disparity.
I don’t have the official stats for what I am about to claim but I am 100% sure that the Minnesota Timberwolves lead the league in bat-shiite crazy fouls. Whether it’s Shaddy trying to jump inside of Brandon Roy’s shorts in a macho show of look how aggressive I can play defense boobery or the Rhino giving a forearm shiver to the back of an opponent in an attempt to get an offensive rebound, our young, undisciplined, talent-strapped Wolves are gaining a reputation for unparalleled hackery. As any long-time NBA observer will tell you, this sort of thing is a perpetual motion machine; once the refs identify a player or team as being prone to commit bad fouls, more bad fouls are called. This situation further compounds itself when the bad-fouling players/teams are fouled in return and (gasp) the whistle is not blown…which then results in frustration and (double gasp) more bad fouls.
In one particular nasty stretch during the 4th quarter, Craig Smith was hacked in somewhat spectacular fashion by some no-name Blazer. Unfortunately, no whistle was blown. Smith was upset with the call and he took it out on Portland on the next possession by not rotating to his attacker on an open three. Thankfully, the shot was off and Smith grabbed the rebound while possibly being fouled again by the nameless Blazer. On the Wolves next shot (a miss, of course), Smith gave a hard shove to the back of He Who Shall Not Be Named and picked up the offensive foul. He then proceeded to throw both the ball and a hissy fit while picking up a technical. Which brings me to item #2…
2- Soul Searching
Following his technical, the Rhino stayed on the court. I know this shouldn’t surprise me, but isn’t it kind of sad that at this point in the season I’m not exactly sure what it takes to get benched? If throwing a ball (sort of) at the ref after failing to rotate defensively and picking up an offensive foul isn’t on the list, I’m not really sure what passes for standards with Randy Wittman.
Here’s another unofficial stat that the Wolves lead the league in: shots of pre-commercial f-bombs mouthed by dejected Wolves players. Last night saw Corey Brewer and Craig Smith give some adult rated love to the home viewers. In the past 2 contests I’m pretty sure I’ve seen Sebastian Telfair, Al Jefferson, Ryan Gomes, and Shaddy drop the uckfay on live TV. I’d swear too if I was headed off to a place where there appears to be no standards of performance or guidance. Granted, I’m just a casual observer with a League Pass, but this ship seems to be sinking a bit faster in recent games, and for all of the drastic changes that have been promised (another DNP-CD for Chris Richard) I just don’t get the sense that the inmates are listening to whatever it is that Witt is selling anymore. This is just a tad bit troubling with 51 games left to play. We all knew it was going to be bad, but when the coach starts telling local media that he doesn’t really know what to do and the players start acting like they really don’t give a shiite….well, I don’t know what it looks like, but there’s a line to be crossed for hard core fans like myself and I have a nagging sense that its fast approaching.
3- Misc
One of the biggest failures of the Wolves’ coaching staff is the recent post-flu bug rash of yo-yo playing time for young players like Richard and Brewer. Brewer has been additionally yanked around by being switched to the 2; a position he is much more physically suited to play at the moment. The change in minutes and position has had mixed results so far. Brewer isn’t as physically mismatched as he used to be at the 3 and he has improved his shot selection during the past 5 games while shooting 48% from the floor. Also, his assists and steals are up and he runs the floor better than any other rookie in the league. On the downside, his rebounds are way down and he looks even less comfortable with the ball in his hands on the offensive end. Corey looks like he’ll cruise through the rest of the year with 6-8 points on 7-10 shots while getting 2-3 assists and 5-6 rebounds per game. If he can keep up the steals and limit the turnovers while continuing to manage his shot selection, he’ll be all right. However, I don’t want to see too many more f-bombs on the way back to the bench.
According to CNNSI's FanNation Player Fantasy Position Rankings, Randy Foye is listed ahead of Bassy. His latest setback is trying the patience of eager fantasy owners, but he should be worth the wait, says FanNation. "Bite me," says Bassy.
Kevin McHale gets a shot across the bow in the latest run up of Memphis at ESPN.com:
Reality check: Minnesota Timberwolves general manager Kevin McHale likely would swap teams straight up with Memphis if he could.
I don't know. I'd much rather have last year's Florida squad. Speaking of which, how about Toine, Ratliff and the Rhino to the Bulls for Joakim Noah and Ben Wallace?
Speaking of the Gators, will Chris Richard get to play on Rookie Appreciation Night on the 6th?
Is it possible to sign and trade Craig Smith?
How could the Sooners possibly lose to inbreeds from West Virginia?
I’d have more for you tonight but it’s late and I have a long day of caucus organizing to do tomorrow in scenic Iowa.
Until later…
I'm sorry folks, but I can't help but laugh at the people who were talking playoffs before the season. I didn't say anything ear lier in the year because I remember a time when I was drinking the Kool-aid and thinking that Anthony Peeler would brick us into NBA finals. I knew we would be bad, but I didn't think it would get this nasty.
The team is such a disaster, there seems to be no fight left in them. The effort is gone. I have no faith in Witt. He hasn't shown anything that inspires any confidence. This might sound pretty mean, but when I see the off the cuff game stats of Rhino getting 20 and 10, or Jeff getting 20 and 15 on occasion and we still just get blown out. I can't help but think to myself, "Sure Al got us 25 and 10, but someone has to score some points and somebody has to get the rebounds". The fact of the matter is that I cannot begin to think of any of our players as anything but life long scrubs until they show that they can win more than 4 games. I don't care that Big Al has nice double double stats every night, or that Bassy has a decent Assist to turn over ratio; the stats look nice, but all stat sheets need to be filled to some extent. The fact of the matter is that we have won four games, even lucky teams should have at least four wins by now, and most of our losses within last month or so have been embarrassments. I hate to be so down on the wolves, but I haven't seen anything to change my mind.
To continue on the draft thing a little cuz I was too late last trey. I'm seeing thabeet drop on ESPN's top 100 board. Wouldn't he be a good fit for us if we can pick him early in the 2nd round?
A poor man's Mutombo is exactly what we need. A defensive inside precense (that's not spelled right, is it) to couple with the little more defensively challenged AJ. On the offensive end we use AJ as our main low block player with thabeet for cleaning up..
Any thoughts on that? Haven't watched thabeet play but am going too soon with the game versus Notre Dame (televised here on monday)
Yeah! Thabeet looks really good. And he is a huge dude. He could be a real center for the Wolves finally. I think that we will probably draft another 6'5" tweener dude who is not that good at anything in particular. McHale seems to love those guys.
Our teams number one need is for center. We have Foye and Telfair and for now, that is ok. We have people who can play every position except center. We simply have no centers. None!
Richards is small and a rookie and probably more of a backup type guy. After him we have no one!
So yes, please get Thabeet.
As of now Thabeet is probably a pick that will go between 10-15 in the 1st round. He'd be a good value pick if the Wolves could find a way to get a second 1st rounder in the teens. If they go with a guard early, he'd be a fine compliment in the middle round. If they go big early, they should try for DJ Augustin or Ty Lawson if they get their hands on a 2nd 1st rounder...which they won't because they already have a ton of players under contract and they literally can't add any more if they don't get a trade done.
Well Thabeet seems to be fluxating a lot. If you've got ESPN insider you can see that he dropped to late 1st round, early 2nd because he's so raw. I personally also think he won't drop down to the 2nd but hey, dreaming is what keeps me interested ;)
Also keep an eye on Brook Lopez and DeAndre Jordan.
http://sports.espn.go.com/ncb/player/profile?playerId=31765
http://sports.espn.go.com/ncb/player/profile?playerId=36142
Jordan will likely go in the top 5 as he's a freakish athletic talent...a 7 foot Gerald Green. Lopez was on academic probation earlier this year but he's back and doing well. Both are legit 7 footers. Keep an eye on how Lopez does against UCLA and USC in the next 3 days.
First of all, thanks to all of you for contributing so heartily in my absence. I couldn't help but sneak away and catch some action on the tube last night, but it was the second quarter, apparently their worst of the game. Once more there was no closing out on the three point shooters, including James Jones, who just happens to lead the NBA in FG% from outside the arc.
But what is prompting me to spout this morning is Peter Weinhold's note, ratified by the daily beat guys, that Coach Wittman is blaming the loss on a lack of accurate outside shooting. "They packed it in on Al," Witt is quoted as saying in today's Strib. "We have guys knocking shots down, now they have a decision to make. We didn't make them make a decision."
That's a disingenuous spin in two different ways. First of all, last time we heard from Wittman, the coach was ripping his guards for not recognizing mismatches down low and feeding the ball into the paint--in other words, for jacking up shots from outside. Is it any wonder that the backcourt boys kept dishing it to Jefferson--who had 24 shots and 9 free throws--even when Portland was packing it in? Second, if outside shooting is a sudden priority for Wittman, what the hell is he doing starting and then sticking with a backcourt of Telfair and Brewer, a notorious bricklaying tandem who currently own NBA career shooting percentages of 39% and 33%, respectively? Bassy and Brewer combined for 61:34 worth of playing time. Rashad McCants--who despite all his problems remains the team's most potent perimeter threat by a country mile--got 19:15 worth of burn, and Marko Jaric, the backcourt member with the highest shooting percentage thus far this season at 44.5%, played 16:19. Shaddy-Marko shot 3-6 FG and had the exact same number of assists and turnovers in 26 fewer combined minutes as Bassy-Brewer, who shot 4-16 FG.
Again, I didn't see the entire game yet, so I don't know how it all played out. But just from reading the box score, I would say to Wittman: If you want more accurate outside shooting, you might want to think about giving your accurate outside shooters more playing time.
Just another little detail that makes players WANT to play in Minnesota. Think about it: not only will the front office assemble a team without decent perimeter shooting, but they will also call out the mismatched players in public when they don't perform the tasks they were never really brought here to achieve in the first place. Let's not forget that he's talking about a rookie swingman and what was, at the time, considered the leftovers of the KG trade: Bassy. Not only is this chucklenut calling out a rookie (who clearly was better coached at Florida) who just switched over to the 2 a few games ago, but he's calling out the team's most improved player: a guy who has provided the only option to a front office that did their damn best to remove all of them at the point. Nice. Quite the culture of excellence you have going at 600 1st Avenue. Not only will they pick the wrong guy to join the team, but they'll bitch at him when he can't do the things he never should have been expected to do in the 1st place. You stay classy Randy Wittman.
Not only does this BS not jive with Witt's own miserable failure as a coach, it flies right in the face of everything the front office has done as well.
Britt, I've only been reading this blog since beginning of this year so I don't know if you have, but if you haven't you should really consider coaching... You're always so dead on.
Ok that's the last time I'm gonna worship you, but I just had to :p. Britt for t-wolves coach ;)
Britt -
I caught your comments while reading True Hoops bullets. I was shocked to have read them now and sure enough here as well.
Wittman is right about the absence of accurate parameter shooting. But your proposed post-game remedy is off.
First off, you appear to be engaging in worse or worst. Jaric played 16 minutes and didn't take a single shot! The only thing on his stat line is 1 turnover and 1 assist.
Shaddy registered the worst +/- last night for his 19 minutes. He was 0 for 3 from outside the arch, his strongest suit this year. Of the 3 for 6 inside the arch, at least one of the 3 was a lay-up. He remains a foul machine.
Brewer (+5) and Telfair (+2) registered the highest +/- which admittedly isn't saying much. Brewer was assigned to defend Roy whose FG% went from a .45 average to .38 last night. Since defense is half the game (or more) Brewer's burn is fully justified.
CA--
Don't confuse the intent of my message. I never said outside shooting should have been a priority concern last night--Randy Wittman did. I merely stated that if that aspect of the team's play warranted carping and criticism from the coach, there were ways for him to do something constructive about it. I didn't see all of the game or look at the plus/minus for last night, but if your citation is right, it would appear that other aspects of Brewer's and Telfair's game compensated for their combined 25% FG.
Look, every game contains things that each player does well and doesn't do well--a coach can spin it however he wants. The Wolves are in a deep slump and an offensive rut, so that is where Witt is focusing his criticism. The problem I have is that Telfair, for instance, has now been criticized for not exploiting low-post matchups one game, and not hitting outside jumpers the next. And I repeat, it strikes me as disingenuous that Wittman would carp about the squad's inability to shoot from the perimeter as he starts a backcourt in which both players have proven they can't convert--or at least haven't thus far--even 40% of their FGA.
The flat facts of statistics show that, if outside shooting is what you really need, McCants and Jaric are more reliable options. If, as you point out, they ultimately cause more problems than they solve, well then, maybe Wittman ought to put that in context instead of demanding things from players that they haven't shown they can produce. Because on a team this young, fragile, and clueless, that's probably not a recipe for long-term improvement.
In the spirit of AK's suggestion, I attended the Wolves game last night with the intention of concentrating on the coaches discussions during the timeouts. At halftime we walked down from the upper level and I had my son distract J.B. Bickerstaff for an autograph while he walked through the runway as I managed to attach a miniature microphone to his lapel. Then we walked up a couple rows behind center court and sat right behind Kevin McHale.
I have transcribed a discussion of the huddle amongst the Wolve's coaches out on the floor prior to speaking with the players during one of the timeouts in the second half.
************************************************************************
Wittman: I don't know what to do. The guys look tired. They aren't making any shots. I don't know. Jerry?
Sichting: Yeah, I don't know either.
Wittman: Bob, what should we do?
Ociepka: F@#% if I know.
Wittman: J.B., what did your dad do?
Bickerstaff: My dad? He told me to go outside and practice my shot. I don't know what to do.
Wittman: Jesus Christ guys, I'm at a loss here. I've tried just about everything and its the same old thing every night. Come on, Jerry, give me something. What would Flip do?
Sichting: Flip would say to make the extra pass. Swing the ball to the open man.
Wittman: Yeah, thats good. I'll tell them to make the extra pass to the open man on the perimeter. good idea.
Ociepka: Except, what if the extra pass is to Corey.
Wittman:Sh#t! You're right. Scratch that. Okay, now I really don't know what to do. I wish Flip were here.
Sichting: Flip's gone. Get over it. What would Casey do?
Wittman: Dwayne would have been professional. He'd have a plan, at least. But, he had KG. That was different.
Bickerstaff: We only got a few more minutes, we better come up with something.
Wittman: I haven't a clue. I suppose we should tell them to keep shooting. I mean 'toines not even hitting tonight.
Ociepka: What about Green.
Wittman: Right, we'll put Green in. He'll shoot the ball.
Sichting: For Corey, So now we can tell em to make the extra pass.
Bickerstaff: Are you kidding? Shaddy and Green are not going to make the extra pass and neither is 'toine.
Sichting; We'll you can tell 'em to.
Wittman: I don't know. I've told them before. But its the same old thing. All right, well go with Green, 'Toine, Marko, Shaddy and Al. We'll tell them to make the pass to the open guy for a good shot. I don't have any better ideas.
Sichting: Ok coach.
********************************************************************************
And then they strolled to bench. And Green took some shots that didn't fall either. The other timeouts were more of the same and I listened to McHale yell some encouragement to players and taunts at the refs for the remainder of the game. Thats all I have to contribute from last night. The actual game was pretty uninspiring. The highlight was for my son was his discovery of the pizza flavored pretzel.
So I was at the game last night -- probably my 5th of the year. This is by far the worst I've seen them play at home -- I left at the under 9 minute timeout in the 4th (hey, we had to wait an extra 30 minutes for them to get the floor fixed, so the game should have been over by then anyway. . .) Here are my 3 observations:
1. Tonight the problem actually probably WAS jumpshooting. And to BRs point, I think it means going back to the Jaric/McCants backcourt. Starting Telfair and Brewer, despite what they bring to the floor in hustle and on defense, leaves three spots in the starting 5 who aren't threats on their own offensively (assuming you start Richard or Doleac at the 5). I don't think you can win in the NBA playing a lot with three guys on the floor who can't get their own points.
2. I actually thought the defense rotations were actually pretty good for the starting five. In addition, the Wolves were fairly aggressive going to the hole and getting to the line. That's a rairity forn them, but they did it for large stretches of the game. The bench, uh, not so much. That was a large reason why the Blazers made their game breaking runs in the second quarter (parts of which the wolves had 5 reserves on the floor, including the completely cluess GG) and in the latter part of the 3rd quarter. At the same time, the Wolves' offense stagnated as the Blazers switched to a zone and people like Walker and Green bombed from outside with no success.
3. My prescription: lets get back to playing the people who are supposed to be our best players at their true position the most mintues. To me, that means starting McCants and Jaric in the backcourt. I'd do jaric over Telfair because we need some guard who can play D against bigger guards in the backcourt when Shaddy is ont he floor. Then have Gomes, AJ and the "true" center of your choice start up front. I'd then have Telfair backup Jaric, Brewer backup McCants, Walker back up Gomes, Smith backup Jefferson and the other center in reserve. While this would result in less minutes for Smith, from what I've seen of him, he's completely redundant when he's on the floor with AJ and he has real trouble with long, athletic frontcourts like the blazers. I don't know if it will make things better, but at least you'll have players playing their true positions and you will have your best offensive lineup in your starting 5 and you'll have (hopefully) enough offense with the second unit (Walker and Smith) that you can get by. Which is what most teams do.
I'm really posting to much but...
What if McHale and Witt have already figured that they don't want to keep the rhino here because we know have AJ, and they're playing the rhino so much to showcase him to the public? Could they want to show Smith so bad that it's more important than winning?
That could make sense, but if all opposing scouts see is how much he struggles against the larger opponents he's forced to match up with on defense, then it doesn't seem like it's going to garner that much interest from other teams.
The following have been made apparent in my mind:
1) Coach Wittman will never lead a winning team in Minnesota, and there is simply no proof to suggest otherwise. Indeed, it is a man's job we are talking about, however he's simply not cut out to be a head coach in the NBA. The bottom line: An equipment manager could go 4-27 by simply rolling the balls onto the floor and drawing names out of a hat to select rotations. Wittman is now 16-57 since taking over for Casey (who, as we all know, was coaching a 20-20 team at the time). Sixteen and Fifty-Seven. Not that I need to put those numbers in any different perspective for this crowd, however we're all NFL heads, so here goes:
If the Wolves were an NFL team, Casey had them at 4-4 last year before being replaced by Wittman, who subsequently went 2-6 with that same team in the second half of the season. He has followed up that performance with a 1-7 start to this season. Everyone bemoans the front office spin job on players and systems, however the real Kool-Aid here regards Wittman. I feel as though we're being led to believe that because he IS the head coach he should BE the head coach, which is really poor reasoning. There's simply no reason at this point to keep him, although I'd love to see someone try to argue differently.
2) Gerald Green sucks out loud. He's been living off of one summer league dunk, a dunk contest, and a few 10-minute stretches of slightly-above-average basketball for three years now. The 2/3 is simply too big a question mark on this team to waste minutes on a guy who will be playing in Spain (or wherever) next year.
3) The Wolves will likely finish with the league's worst record this season, and they won't be much better in the near future without a dramatic shift in personel. It's high time McHale/Taylor/The-Council-of-Five started thinking draft. I'm crossing my fingers next time and hoping the "best overall" theory of drafting becomes their mantra; let's not have another Roy-Foye debacle.
ESPN's Chris Sheridan gives 8-1 odds for Wittman on his coaching Hot Seat - http://insider.espn.go.com/nba/insider/columns/story?columnist=sheridan_chris&page=CoachHotSeat-080103
One point Sheridan made, though for another coach is that there's a number of big-name guys out there who should be considered an upgrade over Witt: Rick Carlisle, Scott Skiles, Jeff Van Gundy, Larry Brown
Personally, I'd like to see what someone like Carlisle might be able to do. He sure had the Pistons going in the right direction before their owner developed a man-crush on Larry Brown.
I gotta be honest I've only been following the nba for 2 years now through televised games and ESPN, SI, ... (before that my only source was EA sports NBA Live :)). But I'm voting Skiles, he's the one that did a great job (up until this season) to raise young players...
There's really no reason to keep Witt around.
I thought Jerry Sichting did a good job as temporary coach when Wittman was out; the team did collect one of its four wins (over Phoenix, one of the league's best clubs) during his three-game tenure, and almost won another against Atlanta. So I think if a change were to be made, he would be as good a choice as anyone.
But again, the fact that the team is so bad works against any talk about a coaching change, as it would be unlikely to make much difference in the standings (does anyone really believe this team could make the playoffs, even with Zen Master Phil Jackson coaching them?). In fact, the more the Wolves lose the better, since it improves the club's lottery prospects.
Barring some kind of blow-up--coach-choking incident or the like--I don't think we will see a coaching change until after the season.
Snyder, I've got a hunch that Witt was given this season.
I think the KG/Jefferson backlash is interesting. At the start of the season (and even up to now in some places) there seemed to be quite a bit of backlash against KG. It seemed almost vogue to pick one of his perceived flaws (post offense, drawing FTs, last second shots, whatever) and mention it in a back-handed complement that ended with a boost for Big Al (i.e. "KG was great for us, but his lack of post offense really hurt and it'll be easier to build around a traditional big like Al."). Almost like it was against the "Wolves' fan code" to express a sentiment that simply regrets the loss of KG, or like it was impossible to complement Big Al without throwing a sneaky dig at KG into it. It drove/drives me crazy.
Now, I'm seeing the opposite backlash starting to occur. It is starting to become unmistakably clear how any KG/Big Al comp really plays out, and it is becoming harder for even die-hard fans to stomach the product being put on the court every night. It is still slow building, but more and more people are starting to blame Al for the historic bad-ness the same way that people started blaming KG for the lack of playoffs the last few years.
IMO, the reality is this. KG was (and is) arguably the best player in basketball, and with the supporting cast here he could only average 36 wins for the last 3 years. Jefferson is a very good young big man, especially on offense, but with the surrounding talent here the team could legitimately challenge for the worst in NBA history. This tells me that Jefferson may not be "The guy" to build a winner around. But I think he could still be a decent second or third option on a successful team. And there's no shame in that. But for the team (or even fans) to try to sell us that he is the foundation for the future is IMO disingenuous and ultimately leads us to resent Big Al for not being able to be what he perhaps was never meant to be.
My we're a loquacious bunch! Give us an open forum and boom! well over 50 posts.
So, reading the tea leaves here, did anyone notice the little bit in Friday's Strib about Marko and Telfair needing to be separated by teammates at practice? Hmmm. I wonder what that was about. Next, Wittman starts this pair against Denver. Whaddya know, the Nougats throw down 12 straight points before I can get a beer poured.
Why do I get the feeling this team is headed for the toxic waste dump?
I think the team is already in the toxic waste dump. The whole point of Wittman was that he would get the kids to do enough dirty work that they would take the games that the other team didn't show up. With our 4 wins, however, it's apparent that we are unable to beat anyone. It turns out Britt was right about the timing of Wittman calling out his players. It led to one good game, it was too early to give any long term hope for this team.
Here's just hoping we have better luck than we had with the Shaq/Mourning sweepstakes... and certainly better than Memphis last year. And while I'm at the wishing well... GO MIAMI!
Also, now that we know at least 4 of the players we'll be dumping this offseason, do you think Taylor might be more willing to make a 1st round pick purchase? Especially if they can trade Smith or Walker or McCants (not in that order)?
No offense to Rhino Love intended. I think Smith is turning out to good to play limited minutes backing up Al Jefferson. Given their defensive limitations, they play nothing but the 4. Also a splash of cold water if we can pick Beasley.
Obviously, this season has gone worse than anyone could've expected. It's the most inconsistent team I've ever seen, which both speaks to the talent level (decent but not great potential and inexperienced) and the coaching staff (hamstrung by injuries but so concerned with matchups that no set rotation has developed). I've been watching this team since they started, and I'd have to say that the problem isn't one singular thing.
First, let's look at talent. This is the 20th season in team history. When comparing the talent on this team to that on previous teams, I'd say it probably lands somewhere in the middle of the pack, ahead of every team from the pre-Garnett era and contending with some during his tenure here. However, winning teams have some sort of pecking order. Many of the best players need to know they are better than their teammates, and the others need to know they're good enough to have something to offer. This is how roles and rotations are made. Part of the reasons that San Antonio wins is because they rely on Parker, Ginobili, and Duncan to create for the rest of the players and expect the other players to play within the system. The only team that didn't function like this was the '04 Pistons, and that was because most of the guys they played could function within their system.
Unfortunately for the Wolves, the only healthy player who could legitimately claim that they would be in the rotation for any and all of the other teams in the league (at this point in their careers) is Jefferson. Foye would fit into this category, too, but injuries are not an excuse for this team's record.
However, looking at the rest of the league, it's pretty clear that the teams who win are the ones who can take advantage of the way the rules are set up. This means having a system featuring players who are quick and can handle the ball, players who can finish around the basket and draw fouls, players who can jump and have long wingspans for blocking shots and tipping passes (not to mention getting offensive boards), players who are physically strong and not afraid to play a little dirty, players who can make perimeter jumpshots, and players who understand the offensive and defensive systems of their team. Teams who win have players who fit into these categories. We have some of these players, but they're not being asked to fill specific roles on a consistent basis.
The two things this team needs are top-level talent and a consistent style of play. The talent thing has to be addressed through the draft and trades (think Donyell Marshall-for-Gugliotta-type trades). Forget about free agency; when was the last-time a team spent big money to get a player who made them a championship contender? The only one I can think of in the last five years has been Nash. We can use it to get good supporting players, but if a team wastes its money in free agency, it hurts them more than it helps. Luckily, Jefferson's contract is manageable enough that we don't need him to be the best player on the team (remember, we paid Wally Szczerbiak, Terrell Brandon, and Latrell Sprewell similar money). Obviously, losing sucks, but next year, the team will likely either be getting a guard who can score in bunches and/or make things easier for his teammates and/or a big guy who can block shots and potentially do a lot of other things.
The other thing revolves around the system of play. I think the team has had its success when it's consistently looked inside first, crashed the boards hard on both ends, gotten fast-break points, and forced teams to beat them from the perimeter. They have the players to do this, no matter what rotation they use. At this point in the season, they need to have nine guys who play regularly, two guys who are ready in case of injuries/foul trouble, and one guy who only plays in blowouts.
I don't really care who those guys would be; however, I think that if they're really looking toward the future, they need to play Jefferson, Brewer, and Richard consistently. I also think that two veterans out of the foursome of Buckner/Doleac/Madsen/Walker should be in the top 11, if not the top 9.
I think all this anticipation for Foye comin back to save us could be a good thing. If you put somebody high up on a pedastal like that, a lot of pressure to perform exists. Not only do I think Foye will be able to handle the pressure but he will live up to and exceed what is expected of him. Then we will draft Beasley, hire Van Gundy and everything will fall into place.
Post new comment
Blogs
Sports
Baseball:
Warning Track Power by Alex Halsted
Sports:
On the Ball by Britt Robson
Society
Weather:
Dude Weather by Jimmy Gaines
A&E
Fiction:
Write Now! by Terry Faust
Retired
Hockey:
Spazz Dad by Todd Smith
Style:
Hook & Eye
Misc:
Is This News?
Fiction:
Yo, Ivanhoe by Brad Zellar
Food:
Consider the Egg by Stephanie March
Wine:
Beyond the Cask
Food:
Food Fight!
Media:
To the Slaughter
Misc:
Outrage by Staff
Food:
Chef's Table
Guest Commentary:
Just Passing Through
Humor:
Spazz Dad by Todd Smith
Cars:
Road Rake by Chris Birt
Commentary:
Read Menace by Tom Bartel
Society:
The Adventures of Melinda by Melinda Jacobs
Politics:
Defenestrator by Rich Goldsmith
Food:
Breaking Bread by Jeremy Iggers & Ann Bauer
Books:
Cracking Spines by Max Ross
Music:
Hear, Hear by Staff
Art:
The Vicious Circle by 6 Critics
Secrets:
Secrets of the Day by Kate Iverson
Theater:
Seen in the City by Staff
Film:
Talk About Talkies by Staff
- Contact:
- Secrets Staff
- Write to Editors
- Send Press Release
- Reprint Request
- Work at Secrets of the City
- Our Address:
- Secrets of the City
- PO Box 3690
- Minneapolis, MN 55403
- (651) 356-8714
©2002-2009 Entropy Publishing, LLC. No part of this site may be reproduced in any form without the express written permission of Entropy Publishing, LLC. except that an individual may print for personal use and/or forward articles via e-mail to a reasonable number of recipients for personal, non-commercial purposes. Thanks to FAMFAMFAM and Tango Project for their icons.
Media Partners
